As moderator I have deleted the post you, Link, made under the topic title "This is going to happen to me within 2 to 3 years. I followed four of the 20 links that you gave, and they all show the same video clip, an incredibly violent one of a man being beaten to death in graphic detail. This is what passes for entertainment these days, there available for even children to watch.

If you can demonstrate that this video contributes to self learning, or the understanding of Krishnamurti's work, I will consider reinstating it - but I doubt it, very much.

And actually Link, you do not know the manner or time of your death, no one does. And is it not better to look at the manner of our living, right now?

Several times on the forum you have asked for "help". What do you consider could be the nature of such help?

Yes, thats OK... I'm sorry about that Clive... I expected you to delete that.. And thank you for doing so...

Clive Elwell wrote:
And actually Link, you do not know the manner or time of your death, no one does. And is it not better to look at the manner of our living, right now?

HAHA, yes i do agree.. But what if you had a mob after you?? Well, then you had better be strict about K's teaching... K said that when one understands truly the nature of insecurity then one is secure... But if you were given a situation without much room (left or right) then it may be a different ordeal..

I did leave my real info on my profile, and whats wrong with that? if you havent done anything wrong then why be guilty about such things?

I do ultimately feel that i would be OK if i didnt attack back, but without understanding fully the nature of thought and the situation that would only equate to mere control, which is meaningless.

Juan,

What is the nature of insecurity? What is security?

That is what you meant by "understanding of the nature of insecurity (and therefore be psychologically secure despite any situation)"? Is this what you would say to a drowning man?

This post was last updated by Huguette . Wed, 21 Jun 2017.

Juan E wrote:
So, does that "understanding truly the nature of insecurity" needs time or it is understood instantly? ... Do we need any preparation in the form of "room" (which implies time) for us to eventually have a true and instantaneous understanding of the nature of insecurity (and therefore be psychologically secure despite any situation)? ... And if it is so, why that need for us of such room/time to look at that which is ever present in our lives?

You bring up for me Juan this whole question of 'security'. The body cannot be made 'secure', no matter how well it takes care of itself. It can always become ill and some part of it can fail. Security for the psychological 'self' or 'me' is a 'lost cause' because although 'I' have continuity, 'I' have no 'substance'. 'I' am made up from the past, of memories, of experiences, etc. 'I' am in fact an 'image' of an 'individual'. It is the image that craves this security, immortality, a state of happiness, the ability to conquer fear and to become greater and greater with knowledge, money, power, 'understanding', 'goodness', 'compassion','love'.'religion', etc. Physical security is all that is possible for us, the desire for psychological security can only create conflict, misery, sorrow because it is the craving to change the fact of what is taking place to something that is not. It is an escaping from reality to fantasy. It is the creation of a false 'future'/ time we can run to. It is based on the fear of death, isn't it? The fear of our disappearance?

Is the idea of 'being as nothing' (not-a-thing) yet another escape or does it make more sense that that , 'nothing', awareness, alertness, etc. is what we really in essence are? Doesn't that join us to all of mankind and all of nature rather than this 'conditioned' notion that what we are are these frightened, separate, entities looking for psychological security and solace and dying without ever finding it? Strangers in a strange land?

This post was last updated by Dan McDermott Wed, 21 Jun 2017.

Huguette . wrote:
That is what you meant by "understanding of the nature of insecurity (and therefore be psychologically secure despite any situation)"?

Juan E wrote:
Why people always equates "living in the insecurity" to "do nothing by accepting any situation"? ...

Where did I equate anything with anything? Where did I say "accept the situation"?

This post was last updated by Huguette . Wed, 21 Jun 2017.

Link Smickman wrote:
But what if you had a mob after you??

Did you ever read Carlos Casterneda's "A seperate reality, the teachings of a Yaqui indian"? The book (s) concerned Don Juan, a powerful and insightful person with magical powers. Once Carlos said to him, "But you magic can't save you from everything. Imagine you were walking along a road, and around the curve an assasin was waiting for you with a high powered rifle - what could you do then?

Don Juan replied "I wouldn't be walking along that road"

Link Smickman wrote:
But if you were given a situation without much room (left or right) then it may be a different ordeal..

Again, that "if". Are not the challenges that are actually facing us enough to meet, without inventing future ones? But you are not alone in this, Link, I have been watching in myself how the mind is always inventing imaginary situations, and trying to decide how to meet them. Seems crazy.

Juan E wrote:

Clive Elwell wrote:

Don Juan replied "I wouldn't be walking along that road"

If i may ask ... what has this to do with the question Link put to "you" keeping in mind that none of us is neither Carlos Castaneda, nor Don Juan? ... Does it mean that we should compare to Don Juan if we had a mob after us? ... I'm sorry, but i don't get why you quote Don Juan here regarding to Link's question :-? ... If you could explain what you exactly mean.

Hi Juan

I realise that that my post may be somewhat incomprehensible, because it referred to the post by Link that I deleted.

Link seemed to suggest that he 'knew his fate', knew the manner of his death. I was challenging this, challenging the whole idea that we can know our personal futures.

But more that this, I am asking if we are just passive victims of circumstances, or there is a certain amount of intelligence we can use when dealing with the world. For example, I notice that a lot of the violent crimes that happen in the city where I live happen in the early hours when people are going home, perhaps drunk or under the influence of drugs. So does it not make sense not to be in the city centre at those times?

Interestingly, in "The Ending of Tine" (I could not say where exactly) K suggests that his work is bringing change to society, but in a subtle way, a way that is calculated not to antagonise and so bring about resistance.

All this brought to mind that snippet of the book about Don Juan, who, it seemed to me, had many wise things to say about living in this world.

Juan E wrote:
.. Does it mean that we should compare to Don Juan if we had a mob after us? .

I don't think intelligent action ever stems from comparison. As K said, every challenge is new. As Clive said, :-). every challenge is unique to a particular place, time, circumstance, so that action "lifted" from another place, other circumstances, can never be appropriate to the moment