Krishnamurti & the Art of Awakening
A Quiet Space | moderated by Clive Elwell

"Selfying the whole"


Displaying posts 121 - 126 of 126 in total
Fri, 28 Oct 2016 #121
Thumb_img_20150716_212047-1-1 richard viillar France 222 posts in this forum Offline

natarajan shivan wrote:
I suggest you don't mix K with Buddhism and confuse people here.

Natarajan, again you are wrong i'm so sorry... that was never my intention, and K doesn't need interprets, he prefers action.

"Confuse people here"... Maybe through this assertion you try to make me stop to write here? I hope not. And anyway i don't know how talk difrently sorry. One thing seems sure it's that you are confuse to assert such thing.

That's funny because many years ago someone tell me "you interpret buddha's teachings with K pattern..."

There is no pattern, no template to reality Natarajan...are you affraid to lose or change...?

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Fri, 28 Oct 2016 #122
Thumb_leaping_fire_frog_by_sirenofchaos natarajan shivan India 84 posts in this forum Offline

Richard, what I was objecting to is the attempt made by us to reconcile K with the religious conditioning we already have. K or Buddha has to be abandoned once we see what they are pointing to; else we need to see all of their works with fresh eyes which I doubt is a possibility given the nature and propensity of our species towards conditioning and security. What I see is an attempt to reconcile our insecurities with anything newly discovered which leaves no option than to question everything.

This post was last updated by natarajan shivan Fri, 28 Oct 2016.

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Fri, 28 Oct 2016 #123
Thumb_img_20150716_212047-1-1 richard viillar France 222 posts in this forum Offline

natarajan shivan wrote:
what I was objecting to is the attempt made by us to reconcile K with the religious conditioning we already have. K or Buddha has to be abandoned once we see what they are pointing to; else we need to see all of their works with fresh eyes which I doubt is a possibility given the nature and propensity of our species towards conditioning and security. Whatever I see is an attempt to reconcile our insecurities with anything newly discovered which leaves no option than to question everything.

I'm agree with you.. so please stop to see that i try to convince or interpret with a pattern. I have lost K teachings as buddha teachings the moment i saw in me the possibility to see what they were talking about...

I'm not buddhist or Krishnamurtian lol...

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Fri, 28 Oct 2016 #124
Thumb_donna_and_jim_fb_bw Tom Paine United States 2445 posts in this forum Offline

Clive Elwell wrote:
It seems so since this 'seeing' is something I cannot do through my own efforts. It seems that any and all effort by me prevents seeing/understanding myself as I am.

But Tom, What you say here IS seeing is it not?

It's meditation... 'seeing' the nature of division in 'me'. If this is truly understood, it IS seeing,yes...seeing which is not divided from understanding or insight.... which is very different than intellectual understanding.

Here's K again on the importance of understanding:

"Naturally, having my mind distorted by this idea of class distinction, I cannot understand, I cannot meet life openly, freely, simply. Or again, if I have been brought up with strong religious doctrines or with some particular training, my thoughts and emotions are perverted; with this background of prejudice I go forth to meet life, and this prejudice naturally prevents my complete understanding of life."

Let it Be

This post was last updated by Tom Paine Fri, 28 Oct 2016.

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Fri, 28 Oct 2016 #125
Thumb_kinfonet_avatar Clive Elwell New Zealand 4855 posts in this forum Offline

Looking at some of the posts above, it is interesting, is it not, to see that as soon as there is any kind of adherence to an ideology, an idea, division between people starts up. Ideas ARE divisive, not matter what their nature, their content is.

Can we not start from a position of not-knowing? There is no division in that. Can we not take ANYONE's words as authority. And most important, can we not take what we know, think we know, as authority?

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Sat, 29 Oct 2016 #126
Thumb_img_20150716_212047-1-1 richard viillar France 222 posts in this forum Offline

Clive Elwell wrote:
Can we not start from a position of not-knowing? There is no division in that. Can we not take ANYONE's words as authority. And most important, can we not take what we know, think we know, as authority?

Yes Clive indeed i'm totaly agree with that. ..

and to not take what we see, understand, know... as authority necessite to see the movement which take all that as authority...

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