Krishnamurti & the Art of Awakening
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Does reading books help to see what is?


Displaying posts 31 - 42 of 42 in total
Fri, 06 Mar 2015 #31
Thumb_001 Sean Hen Spain 882 posts in this forum Offline

Jack Pine wrote:
These books are a block to seeing what is because they add to the load of conditioning we are already which filters the present through the past.

Hello Jack,

It appears to me that you are making a generalisation here. If any book, whether written by Krishnamurti or not, actually helps us to be more aware of our conditioning and helps us see how our conditioning pollutes our experience of the present, then I think this is valid. I mean, if you read a book and after reading this book you are more awake to inattention, quicker to see a thought arise which distracts you from being in contact with what is going on around you, then this is actually helping you to "see". Obviously, if the book merely adds on another layer of conditioning then it is not going to help, but rather dull the sharpness of the mind in perceiving what is going on around it.

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Fri, 06 Mar 2015 #32
Thumb_img_0244 Jack Pine United States 5742 posts in this forum Offline

Sean Hen wrote:
If any book, whether written by Krishnamurti or not, actually helps us to be more aware of our conditioning and helps us see how our conditioning pollutes our experience of the present, then I think this is valid.

Hi Sean,

Yes Sean I agree with your above statement. I think what I'm trying to say is that once a person becomes aware, through reading or hearing Krishnamurti, that conditioning is all pervasive and a block to further understanding then the books are not going to help. Then we are on our own to see for ourselves that conditioning as it manifests as the self.

Sean, I suspect we may be saying the same thing: That books can only take you so far. The rest is up to each of us to see for ourselves.

This post was last updated by Jack Pine Fri, 06 Mar 2015.

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Fri, 06 Mar 2015 #33
Thumb_stringio Pavil Davidov Poland 4402 posts in this forum ACCOUNT DELETED

Krishnamurti Quote of the Day | Mar 06, 2015 "An incomplete experience leaves a scar or a residue whereas a completed experience does not leave any residue."

Then (if K's statement is accepted) the question is, in any particular case: Is the experience of reading the book 'completed' or does it leave a residue?

"Wherever you go, there you are." Insight from Mullah Nasruddin

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Sat, 07 Mar 2015 #34
Thumb_stringio randall merryman United States 3832 posts in this forum ACCOUNT DELETED

Pavil Davidov wrote:
Is the experience of reading the book 'completed' or does it leave a residue?

Could you define more precisly what you think K means by "residue"?

Stuff happens

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Sat, 07 Mar 2015 #35
Thumb_stringio randall merryman United States 3832 posts in this forum ACCOUNT DELETED

Sean Hen wrote:
if you read a book and after reading this book you are more awake to inattention, quicker to see a thought arise which distracts you from being in contact with what is going on around you,

That's a very big "if" Sean. "if" it helps us to be awake once or twice a week, in our spare time, for a moment or two, is it valid?

If on the other hand it is a way of life, done when the situation requires it(not necessarily 24/7) then we might say it is an adequate action.

Stuff happens

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Sat, 07 Mar 2015 #36
Thumb_photo_jg4 Jean Gatti Belgium 8638 posts in this forum Offline

Pavil Davidov wrote:
if K's statement is accepted

Why would you 'accept' any statement ?

Why not SEE it yourself ?

??

K101

Why resist 'what is' ?

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Sat, 07 Mar 2015 #37
Thumb_stringio mike c United States 941 posts in this forum ACCOUNT DELETED

Pavil Davidov wrote:
Then (if K's statement is accepted) the question is, in any particular case: Is the experience of reading the book 'completed' or does it leave a residue?

In the case of K's books, there remain tantalyzing bits that have stuck with me for years. I recognize a great truth in them, but can't totally realize them, and so they remain stocked away in my mind as treasures, to go back to time and again in my life. To me, this is part of the beauty that was this great teacher. I imagine most people recall transcendant pieces of books, poetry, movies, that remain in one for a lifetime...

"Fled is that music, do I wake or sleep?"

This post was last updated by mike c (account deleted) Sat, 07 Mar 2015.

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Sat, 07 Mar 2015 #38
Thumb_001 Sean Hen Spain 882 posts in this forum Offline

Jack Pine wrote:
Sean, I suspect we may be saying the same thing: That books can only take you so far. The rest is up to each of us to see for ourselves.

Hello again Jack,

Yes, I can see that we do indeed seem to agree on this. Thanks for clearing this up.

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Sat, 07 Mar 2015 #39
Thumb_001 Sean Hen Spain 882 posts in this forum Offline

randall merryman wrote:
That's a very big "if" Sean. "if" it helps us to be awake once or twice a week, in our spare time, for a moment or two, is it valid?

Hello Randall,

I would say that being awake once or twice a week is probably better than nothing. Perhaps any moment that we are fully awake may lead to more extended moments of complete attention. Having the clarity to see a thought arise and watch it from the outside obviously requires great attention.

randall merryman wrote:
If on the other hand it is a way of life, done when the situation requires it(not necessarily 24/7) then we might say it is an adequate action.

I would agree with you here Randall but actually doing this seems to be a great challenge.

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Sat, 07 Mar 2015 #40
Thumb_stringio Pavil Davidov Poland 4402 posts in this forum ACCOUNT DELETED

randall merryman wrote:
Could you define more precisly what you think K means by "residue"?

Well, the words, "experience," "complete" and "residue" all deserve equal treatment, I feel. But I think he was referring to "Hurts" and other such 'psychological' residues. That which is left and continues is unfinished business looking for a conclusion, which it will never find. Like digging a hole to find the bottom.

"Wherever you go, there you are." Insight from Mullah Nasruddin

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Sat, 07 Mar 2015 #41
Thumb_stringio Pavil Davidov Poland 4402 posts in this forum ACCOUNT DELETED

Jean Gatti wrote:

Pavil Davidov wrote:
if K's statement is accepted

Why would you 'accept' any statement ?

'Accept' as someone would accept a new tool to do a difficult work. To take and use, to 'try out'. In the use, one finds the truth of it, or otherwise.

"Wherever you go, there you are." Insight from Mullah Nasruddin

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Sun, 08 Mar 2015 #42
Thumb_stringio mike c United States 941 posts in this forum ACCOUNT DELETED

Pavil Davidov wrote:
But I think he was referring to "Hurts" and other such 'psychological' residues. That which is left and continues is unfinished business looking for a conclusion, which it will never find. Like digging a hole to find the bottom.

I don't think it's like digging a hole trying to find the bottom, but something like a 'stain' on perception. To wipe it away through perception seems like the issue. And our everyday experience of life is the seeing through stains; they color our whole perception; they are our perception of life- the hurts, the fears, pleasures, desires, etc. They are our whole experience of life.

This post was last updated by mike c (account deleted) Sun, 08 Mar 2015.

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