Krishnamurti & the Art of Awakening
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randall merryman (account deleted)'s Forum Activity | 3898 posts in 2 forums


Forum: General Discussion Sun, 01 Dec 2013
Topic: Is the thinker making choices ?

Jean Gatti wrote: It is said

By whom? We are being asked to speculate on a random anonymous quote? Absurd sir, quite absurd.

Forum: General Discussion Sun, 01 Dec 2013
Topic: Thought, in all its glory

b aurelien wrote: If one considers that the human mind is the most advanced and extraordinary thing that exists, in term of life and evolution, why have we created, as human beings, such an absurd and destructive society in the world?

Well, have you not shown that the human mind is only the most advanced and extraordinary thing, in the imagination of a human mind?

Forum: General Discussion Sun, 01 Dec 2013
Topic: Who is hiding behind the mask ?

Jean Gatti wrote: WHO then is hiding behind this mask ?

Probably the same entity who/that defined the word "person", in latin or english or german or french or chinese ......

We could speculate about the imaginings of human thought, but why? Maybe because it's the only game available to entertain the "who"?

Forum: General Discussion Mon, 02 Dec 2013
Topic: Relationship

Rajiv Fonn wrote: without it we will all live in poverty both physically and psychologically.

That's not quite right, is it? :)There is no right relationship for the becoming human psyche, is there? LOL And so, the suggestions made, about what something that does not exist (right relationship) might be or do, are not really helpful, are they? :) They simply sort of, muddy the water, don't they?:)

Forum: General Discussion Mon, 02 Dec 2013
Topic: Alternate Experience.

Yogi Irushad wrote: It is good to control the mind, which is hard to check. It is swift and wanders at will. A controlled mind bring happiness.

Buddha spoke in English?

Forum: General Discussion Mon, 02 Dec 2013
Topic: Relationship

b aurelien wrote: And the same process may also exist into the relationship one may have with oneself, inwardly ?

lol:) but if we focus on the objects we desire to relate with (people places and things), rather than explore the nature of relationship in and of itself, we may forever be isolated within our imagination, about relationships. :)

Forum: General Discussion Mon, 02 Dec 2013
Topic: Relationship

Rajiv Fonn wrote: if it did not exist, K would not have spoken about it.

:) Can't argue with logic like this. :)

Forum: General Discussion Mon, 02 Dec 2013
Topic: Relationship

mike christani wrote: It was perhaps a hint into what right relationship might be.

:) certainly if what you discribe is not fanciful imagination, then clarity is there, there is no confusion about it. :) It is only when we are dreaming (about relationship), that questions still linger. :)

Forum: General Discussion Mon, 02 Dec 2013
Topic: Is the thinker making choices ?

Jean Gatti wrote: thought is NOT the thinker, thought is real (as a material process involving matter and energy), while the thinker is merely a creation of thought,

:) then what does Krishnamurti mean, when he talks about the "observer is the observed"? :) and "there is no division"? :)

Forum: General Discussion Mon, 02 Dec 2013
Topic: Is the thinker making choices ?

Jean Gatti wrote: It means the observer and the observed are ONE and the same, there is no division,

lol, and you are saying one is real (thought) and one is not (thinker). :) but if they are one and the same exact phenomenon.......?:)

Forum: General Discussion Tue, 03 Dec 2013
Topic: Relationship

Rajiv Fonn wrote: that would only lead to a highly theoretical discussion which doesn't help understanding.

Please point to one discussion on this entire forum which is not, highly theoretical. :)

:) If you are happy with the nature of relationship, as it applies to your life, carry on.:)

Forum: General Discussion Tue, 03 Dec 2013
Topic: Relationship

me speak wrote: you overlooked our relationship with 'ideas'

Certainly this could come under the heading "places" or even "things".

Forum: General Discussion Tue, 03 Dec 2013
Topic: Relationship

b aurelien wrote: That is, one can only explore the nature of relationship, in action, in relationship, right ?

It may be so. But why do you suggest it? :) Because it's a fact? because it's a direct observation of the phenomenon in question? :)Or simply a belief which is tradition? :)

Forum: General Discussion Wed, 04 Dec 2013
Topic: Relationship

Pandavi X wrote: You are still advising. No matter.

Is advice or even the advsior, the critical factor in the relience on authority? I mean, weeding out wrong/bad advice piece by piece, one at a time might mean we could spend an eternity, trying to figure out right and wrong by the traditional methods, right? Wrong?:)

Forum: General Discussion Wed, 04 Dec 2013
Topic: Relationship

Rajiv Fonn wrote: Relationship only exists between people, places and things,

Is this a statement of expertese?:)

But when you/we take the object as the fundamental factor in the phenomenon of relationship/love/death/compassion/meditation/sunshine (insert your own personal jesus here) you/we tend to stray our attention away from possibly the/an critical/very important factor. :) Maybe anyway, who knows? Couldn't hurt to go off the traditional path.

Forum: General Discussion Wed, 04 Dec 2013
Topic: Is the thinker making choices ?

Pandavi X wrote: Thought as the 'thinker' may indeed spoil many such choices with irrelevant concerns. I am not at all sure however that thought as the thinker is the inevitable bad guy.

But isn't it (division of thought as thinker) a constant shift off of/out of, symbiosis/attention?

Forum: General Discussion Wed, 04 Dec 2013
Topic: Is the thinker making choices ?

Pandavi X wrote: A person may not be able to lose his shadow but it need not weigh him down!

But it does. The burden of repetitive/looped thinking, does weigh the human psyche down. Why do you suggest otherwise? Your analogy doesn't seem to hold, as natural phenomenon (gravity) is/are extremely predictible in that it/they is/are in harmony with/in it's laws/environment. Can the same be said about the irrational manifestations of the human mind (society)? Again please, why do you suggest otherwise?

Forum: General Discussion Wed, 04 Dec 2013
Topic: Is the thinker making choices ?

Jean Gatti wrote: this is how conditioned thought works

Is there division between conditioning and thought? :)

Or are they one and the same phenomenon? :)

Isn't our thinking, the phenomenon/factor of conditioning/programming? :)

Forum: General Discussion Wed, 04 Dec 2013
Topic: Is the thinker making choices ?

Pandavi X wrote: A shift OF the symbiosis rather than a shift OUT OF symbiosis. The symbiosis I am writing about is that between movement and stillness. The centre of gravity of this symbiosis shifts towards a gravitational centre called 'self.' Stillness becomes the condition in which the self is satisfied, which is always temporary.

Is this a theory you came up with all by yourself, Paul? :)

So you suggest that balance/symbosis is a shifting point?

Forum: General Discussion Wed, 04 Dec 2013
Topic: Is the thinker making choices ?

Pandavi X wrote: we are constantly trying to hold back to correct the shadow.

Pardon my saying so, but this is not an qdequate response. :)

Forum: General Discussion Wed, 04 Dec 2013
Topic: Is the thinker making choices ?

Pandavi X wrote: but conflict with gravity only arises when one tries to get airborne.

Why do you suggest that the laws of gravitational force, are a form of conflict? The so-called conflict, is exclusivly in the mind, right? I want to fly, but I cannot.

Forum: General Discussion Wed, 04 Dec 2013
Topic: Is the thinker making choices ?

Pandavi X wrote: It seems to be a principle that one can only leave behind what has been understood.

yes quite, the past burns in the flame of attention, got ya. :)

Forum: General Discussion Wed, 04 Dec 2013
Topic: Is the thinker making choices ?

Pandavi X wrote: Bear in mind that even the irrational is functional.

I don't quite see why you suggest this, please elaborate. :)

I agree that, for instance, slavery is functional. That war is functional. Violence is functional and so on. One could find a function or maybe rather dysfunction in many of the activities of the human biological entity. But what is your point, really? :)

Forum: General Discussion Wed, 04 Dec 2013
Topic: Is the thinker making choices ?

Jean Gatti wrote: Yes 'conditioned thought' refers to thought which is corrupted by a sense of self, 'center' or 'thinker'

I won't argue your thesis here, but I will suggest that thought, applied to situations where it has not functioned adequately historically (relationship) is the same exact process/phenomenon as when/where it is applied to areas where it does tend to work well.

Forum: General Discussion Wed, 04 Dec 2013
Topic: Is the thinker making choices ?

Pandavi X wrote: All thought is conditioned, whether by physical or psychological realities. Thought is a material process, therefore conditioned

I do beg your pardon, but this is non-sensical gibberish. :)

Forum: General Discussion Wed, 04 Dec 2013
Topic: Is the thinker making choices ?

Jean Gatti wrote: Let us not play with words and bring such confusion in the debate ...

but this is the only way to debate opinions/beliefs. :)

Forum: General Discussion Wed, 04 Dec 2013
Topic: Relationship

me speak wrote: understanding the structure/nature of advice (received), advisor (you) and the 'me' that gives importance to them are critical factors in understanding the fact that 'authority' rules psyche.

But the core problem is the traditional methodology, belief (inner authority). Not the dribblings of some schmuck on the internet.

Forum: General Discussion Wed, 04 Dec 2013
Topic: Relationship

Jean Gatti wrote: I would say creation of duality (good/evil) ... identification with a limited form, a fragment ... hence time and impermanence ... and death ...

Sorry jean, but this is simply more non-sensical gibberish/belief/opinion/knowledge/time. :)

Forum: General Discussion Wed, 04 Dec 2013
Topic: Is the thinker making choices ?

Jean Gatti wrote: Yes, but there must be at least some understanding of K's teachings, no ? and some clarity of mind ... which seems not to be the case with our new friends ...

I will only suggest jean, that K's whole message is/was, that there is understanding and clarity of mind.....only in our imagination.

Forum: General Discussion Wed, 04 Dec 2013
Topic: Is the thinker making choices ?

Pandavi X wrote: Usually we do not look at things functionally but simply reject what we don't like.

But isn't "functionally" the opposite of what we don't like? Aren't you using the term "function" in the same manner as "utility"?