Krishnamurti & the Art of Awakening
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Ana Flavia Lucas' Forum Activity | 28 posts in 1 forum


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Forum: General Discussion Thu, 28 Apr 2011
Topic: Verbal Awareness

To want is just a verb to describe for ourselves and communicate to others an urge (another name for a nameless feeling and body movement). In my experience, to be aware of the urge includes words in my mind - sometimes even explanations. But the explanations and words may trick me, and give me new urges... May we communicate and understand beyond (or beneath) the verbal, with our whole minds, even when we are writing words, as we are here? Are these words in the Forum important at all for our awareness??

Forum: General Discussion Fri, 29 Apr 2011
Topic: Verbal Awareness

Thank you, Paul.

Tihit, I liked your comments and they made me think how difficult it is for me to translate from Brazilian Portuguese to English and talk with you all, and not just because of the words. I was wondering that, if we have different languages and conditionings, which prevents better communication, we probably have more simmilar feelings and body perceptions, or maybe not?? Could the total awareness (verbal and non-verbal integrated) we are talking about make we communicate better and understand better ourselves and each other? It seems to me that yes, because I can be closer with very different (in class, age or culture) people in my own country when I overcome the verbal language barrier, look deep into their eyes and smile.Then the words may have more meaning and be about what it is. Does it make sense?

Forum: General Discussion Fri, 29 Apr 2011
Topic: Verbal Awareness

May i presume such a quite mind has already there with the study of JK and we are communicating only after that (gb)

I am sorry, gb, but my mind is usally noisy, as far as I know. I am seeing and working on that, reading and watching Krishnamurti, and having interesting insights... But I can't wait a quiet mind to be here in this Forum, even if I understand that maybe to real communicating it is necessary a quiet mind...

Forum: General Discussion Fri, 29 Apr 2011
Topic: Verbal Awareness

max greene wrote: It seems to me that they have importance when they quieten a mind so that awareness and understanding are then possible.

Yes, Max, thank you. The interesting thing for me is that it happens (the quieten of the mind) with some words that fit, but also sometimes when I am with Nature, people, doing yoga or some moments I can't explain - (no words for that)?? Then the words just go away - and return when I think : I don't want to loose this moment or What happened?

Forum: General Discussion Sun, 01 May 2011
Topic: la liberación interior

carlos david wrote: es posible un cambio radical en esta manera de vivir en la cual estamos siempre en conflicto con todo?

Yo no lo se, Carlos. Pero pienso que, por todo lo que dices, es importante y necesario tratar de vivir esto cambio radical a cada momento, ahora, en tu vida ordinaria, sin ninguna seguridad de que lo vamos a lograr. No hay seguridad en esto, pero intertarlo is choiceless en el momento en que se mira todo lo que ahí esta. Salutaciones desde Brasil

Forum: General Discussion Tue, 03 May 2011
Topic: AWARENESS

It seems the whole thing may be much simpler than all the words and concepts that we use when we try to explain. Of course if we take it seriously we can't just believe in K, but look into ourselves. When I look into myself, the very notion that all awareness is there somewhere, hidden by conflict, noise, intellectual opinions and prejudices and so many judgements and justifications seems very plausible and interesting. Instead of search and build, maybe we just need to let it go. And observe with intense attention, not in a serious way and with no effort, but with the persistence and joy of a child looking for something the first time. Can we be aware ourselves (not of ourselves) for the first time?

Forum: General Discussion Tue, 03 May 2011
Topic: K said so?

Why are you, HI, so bitter and disapointed? Maybe you could look at that, instead of blaming the world for being hopeless (which may be true...). But, of course, it is just an impertinent suggestion, because I am just a sleeping monkey...looking inside and around, what is the same.

Forum: General Discussion Thu, 05 May 2011
Topic: Osama bin Laden and the Wages of War

Yvonne Bokobza wrote: it is clear to anyone :)

Not to me. It is not clear to me any rewarding in that phrase and it is also not clear why all this confrontation, which does not seems to make anything clearer...just creates more conflict, in my way of looking at it.

Forum: General Discussion Fri, 03 Jun 2011
Topic: IDENTITY

Poem from Ricardo Reis ( one of the heteronomous of Fernando Pessoa, a Portuguese writer)

Countless lives inhabit us.

I don’t know, when I think or feel,

Who it is that thinks or feels.

I am merely the place

Where things are thought or felt.

I have more than just one soul.

There are more I’s than I myself.

I exist, nevertheless,

Indifferent to them all.

I silence them: I speak.

The crossing urges of what

I feel or do not feel

Struggle in who I am, but I

Ignore them. They dictate nothing

To the I I know: I write.

Paul, what about IdentitieS? Part of the crisis? And what about the I I know that ignores and silences them? Just another delusion? Or merely the place where things are thought or felt??

Forum: General Discussion Sun, 05 Jun 2011
Topic: IDENTITY

Paul Davidson wrote: That is (in my own words), there is something that remains within mind, despite its conditioning, something that needs to develop and prosper. But it can only do so when the other dies. Mind knows intimately that it is, in itself, a lonely and craven thing. But it does not know what it lacks.

What the mind lacks is integral being.

Thank you for your beautiful answer, Paul. I usually read the posts here but don't feel like posting myself - not much to say. Anyhow, it is a way of being together and understanding together, even when just reading, isn't it?

Forum: General Discussion Wed, 08 Jun 2011
Topic: Fear of the Unconscious

Interesting, Paul. It reminds me your other posts on Honesty, because to face our daemons(that usually are not as ugly as they seem while they are hidden), to let them appear, and to be alert and ready for them, requires a lot of honesty. It is easier to create beautiful and sometimes quite complex fantasies ( even when there is a permanent and subconscious suspicious that something is wrong or fake on that) than to face our own thoughts in its bare simplicity, especially when "we", or "I" don't "agree" with the mad thoughts one may have. To meditate, in this perspective, is "just" to be alert and aware of the thoughts, in the way they come, and don't judge, agree or disagree with them, but just to look at the strange thoughts that may seem so contradictory. In my experience, sometimes it may happen an insight and understanding, the whole thing makes sense and the specific thoughts vanish. It may be a way of free oneself by facing what the self struggles to keep hidden - the unconscious. Would it help also to dissolve the self??

Forum: General Discussion Fri, 26 Aug 2011
Topic: PRIDE AND VANITY

Paul Davidson wrote: Let us start with one thing, maybe vanity.>

Dear Paul. As a Portuguese speaker, I need to look at the definition and found:

  1. The quality or condition of being vain.
  2. Excessive pride in one's appearance or accomplishments; conceit. See Synonyms at conceit.
  3. Lack of usefulness, worth, or effect; worthlessness.

  4. a. Something that is vain, futile, or worthless. b. Something about which one is vain or conceited.

Is it vanity an excess of pride? Is it just a quantitative issue?

Forum: General Discussion Fri, 26 Aug 2011
Topic: Unknown???

Light Hunter wrote: Still, I say, there is no Unknown.

Cacador ( ou cacadora? ) de luz,

Como voce expressaria esta frase em portugues? Toda esta questão esta me parecendo um pouco obscura, e nao compreendo se voce esta aqui para caçar a luz dos outros para voce mesmo ou para distribuir... O que significa caçar luz? Parece um pouco vao...e nao percebo o real sentido do post. Afirmar tao categoricamente que nao ha o desconhecido importaria porque? E porque isto refutaria K? Ou nao e esta sua intenção?

Desculpe a falta de acentuacao mas o sitio nao comporta adequada acentuacao em nossa lingua.

Forum: General Discussion Fri, 26 Aug 2011
Topic: Was K Depressed?

Juan Illan Gomez wrote: Jack, you asked what I meant by depression. I was referring to a mental state characterized by a deficiency of serotonin in the brain. Though daily asanas and long walks, as practiced by K, can increase dopamine and endorphins to alleviate depression, it really does not increase serotonin.

Do you realise how narrow ( and dangerous) this definition of "depression" that you present is? This is just a biological description, very simplistic, of complex neurotransmitters dynamics that can be seen in a human being who is connected with others and the world, and that changes all the time. According to the psychiatry, 20% of humanity should be taking medicines for depression... Don't you think this has something to do with the sorrow, misery, fear and anger we can see everyday inside and around us and that K pointed so well? Would label this as depression make it any better? Would take medicines solve it? I am quite aware of sorrow as it is, inside me and in the world ( as it is one) and I am not at all depressed by that. I think I would be much worse if I were in denial. To face what it is does not make you any sadder, just removes garbage and frees you to a deeper connection with life and everything as it is. What would you prefer? Compassion or fluoxetine??

Forum: General Discussion Sat, 27 Aug 2011
Topic: PRIDE AND VANITY

Dear Paul,

I was talking with a friend and he started to be very excited telling me the success he has been doing in his work. I realise he was trying to impress himself and myself about his achievements and was delighted with his image. I rejected it immediately as ego play, and then found out in myself the very same vanity - his vanity was mine... And then I saw vanity.

It is targeted to impress others, so it is linked with allowing others to judge you and to be lead by others' opinions.

Forum: General Discussion Sat, 27 Aug 2011
Topic: Was K Depressed?

Dear Patricia, Rick, Paul and all

Patricia Hemingway wrote: Is depression the opposite to hope in the corridor of sorrows?

I don’t think so, Patricia. It seems they are quite close. To hope is to project to the future, not being here now... Scape.

I would add to all the interesting posts up to now here on the theme (thank you) something I consider to be a fact: some people sometimes do feel such sadness that they loose volition almost completely. They can’t feed themselves, they can’t clean themselves, they can’t sleep properly, then try to and they (we) kill themselves (ourselves?). These people deserve proper and integrated care, don’t them? But what is happening is that the supposed "health" care doubles the pain, as Paul said.

Originally, the labels are meant to inform the treatment/action. Blind leading blinds…

What would be the right action? Should we do nothing? Just to be sensitive? All “care” is division?

Forum: General Discussion Sun, 28 Aug 2011
Topic: Was K Depressed?

Muad dheeb wrote: Occasionally I talk to people in deep distress , willing to help is the worse to do, willing to share what is deeply known is the right thing to do..then exist a real communication...

And it needs no judgement at all.

Juan Illan Gomez wrote: Paying attention might be the right action.

Patricia Hemingway wrote: One is left with great sadness. And with the compassion of realization that the whole of humanity is - in one way or another - facing this same dilemma.

Dear friends,

Thank you for your posts. They made sense to me. Patricia, I agree, we are all facing the same dilemma, even when we are not aware of it... And even when communication may be difficult to flow, making things even worse.

Forum: General Discussion Sun, 28 Aug 2011
Topic: Unknown???

Ravi Seth wrote: translation

Thank you, Ravi.

Forum: General Discussion Thu, 15 Sep 2011
Topic: What does it mean...to be resonable?

Jack Pine wrote: You saturate the site with your posts which are mostly composed of your unsubstantiated opinions, ideas and beliefs. This site belongs to all of us who would post here and it is about what K pointed out not about anyone's random opinions and beliefs. And Jack Pine wrote: You have, apparently, gulled a couple of women and maybe some others into believing you actually know something worthwhile about what K pointed out.

Hi all, I am a frequent reader of this site but barely feel like posting. But I would like to say that I, like Sylvia, Ganesan, Julian and Julia, appreciate very much the freedom, passion, creativity and sincerity of Paul's posts. Maybe the fact that some of us happen to be a woman makes Jack dismiss me as easy to gull. If Jack’s male ego is feeling dominated in this thread, as it seems to me in the statement “the site belongs to all of us” he may easily opens a new thread of his own. I do prefer to read K itself to know what he said in first hand, but sometimes it adds to my understanding to hear about how others are doing their internal work, as I am doing mine. It is our work, our world, our teachings and our site. Competition, envy, rudeness, pettyness and arrogance are outside and inside all the time, but to look at them (we) without judgement is the intelligent thing to do. If we see it deeply and intensely we may understand the futility and ignorance in that and then it is gone….

Forum: General Discussion Thu, 22 Sep 2011
Topic: Observations

ganesan balachandran wrote: All my vedic quotes are copy( not computer generated copy and paste)

ganesan balachandran wrote: with occasional interpretations or substituting words like agni, soma, Indra ....with intelligence, awareness, love , ecstacy ....so on.as i understood.

Thank you very much for that, GB! I am not allways able to understand, but even then, I, or something in me, likes it.

Forum: General Discussion Fri, 23 Sep 2011
Topic: Observations

ganesan balachandran wrote: Is that not with K also:)

Bingo!! ( As you say in Kinfonet's dialect)

Forum: General Discussion Wed, 28 Sep 2011
Topic: A stroll in a day..... a reflection of the mind....past, present,&future.

Yesterday I was walking in the streets of São Paulo, busy streets, with lots of cars. I was leaving my work and going quickly to the underground, dreaming in arrive home and rest for a while. I had to walk about 8 blocks, and was submerged in the past- things that had just happened in the examination board I was, what the student said, what I should have said... Then I saw a car in the sidewalk, going back to the street - it was parked there, these are Sao Paulo streets. Autommatically, I stopped - cars have preference at São Paulo´s streets, and sidewalks. But the driver looked at me, saw me in the middle of the crowd, and I saw her. She smiled at me and stopped the car. I continued my walk, back to here and now. Time stopped when I saw the driver, the space between us disapeared. And I continued my walk, thinking in how good I felt when a complete stranger, for a moment, made real contact with me, in the middle of the crowd, and how I was back to present after that.

Forum: General Discussion Thu, 29 Sep 2011
Topic: A stroll in a day..... a reflection of the mind....past, present,&future.

Dr.sudhir sharma wrote: Temporary relief from the clutches of the self because of certain events or happenings is not equivalent to its ending, is it?

No,it is not. When I entered in the underground it had gone... But it is all I have now, moments of awareness that make me see how much I've been dreaming... I am also pretty aware that to judge myself because this is too little will not help...

Forum: General Discussion Fri, 30 Sep 2011
Topic: A stroll in a day..... a reflection of the mind....past, present,&future.

Dr.sudhir sharma wrote: What is wrong by saying to yourself that moments of awareness are too little?

Nothing wrong or right, nothing to supress. I was only answering your question that of course I am aware that temporary relief is not equivalent to complete ending, and, as this is quite obvious, added my understanding about the futility on judging what it is.

Forum: General Discussion Tue, 07 Feb 2012
Topic: Freedom

Peng Shu Tse wrote: On one's own one finds nothing. Everything is found in relationship. To relationship all credit is due. A healthy mind gravitates to that which nourishes it. A diseased mind cannot distinguish between food and poison.

Nice synthesis of something important, Peng. Well put.

Forum: General Discussion Sat, 21 Apr 2012
Topic: outsiders

alt text

"The circle – unbroken – harmony, unity! looking at these children – no one at the head, no one at the end but side by side as one, together as a whole – its the picture of love. A circle with no beginning, no end – endless love – the rosary!

This is what NHA seeks – love, peace and unity for everyone – no in-groups, no out-groups – but for everyone …… and why praying the life of Christ in the rosary is so important to us."

(The above image and text is in the site of Nazareth House Apostolate, Sierra Leone, http://www.nazarethhouseap.org/category/circle/)

They are talking about outsiders as well, aren't them? What about discomfort now?

Forum: General Discussion Fri, 18 May 2012
Topic: Without ideals.

To Katy,

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tg1DdcRwqyw&...

Love, Ana

Forum: General Discussion Fri, 18 May 2012
Topic: Without ideals.

To Ramona

Bob Dylan

Ramona, come closer Shut softly your watery eyes The pangs of your sadness Will pass as your senses will rise The flowers of the city Though breathlike, get deathlike at times And there's no use in tryin' To deal with the dyin' Though I cannot explain that in lines.

Your cracked country lips I still wish to kiss As to be by the strength of you skin Your magnetic movements Still capture the minutes I'm in But it grieves my heart, love To see you tryin' to be a part of A world that just don't existv It's all just a dream, babe A vacuum, a scheme, babe That sucks you into feelin' like this.

I can see that your head Has been twisted and fed With worthless foam from the mouth I can tell you are torn Between stayin' and returnin' Back to the South You've been fooled into thinking That the finishin' end is at hand Yet there's no one to beat you No one to defeat you 'Cept the thoughts of yourself feeling bad

I've heard you say many times That you're better 'n no one And no one is better 'n you If you really believe that You know you have Nothing to win and nothing to lose From fixtures and forces and friends Your sorrow does stem That hype you and type you Making you feel That you gotta be just like them.

I'd forever talk to you But soon my words They would turn into a meaningless ring For deep in my heart I know there is no help I can bring Everything passes Everything changes Just do what you think you should do And someday, maybe Who knows, baby I'll come and be cryin' to you.

Kate, I am happy you heard my message. Wish you can find someone you can talk face to face. Anyhow, I am here listening and the pain is shared. "There is no help anyone can bring", but there is compassion. Love, Ana

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