Krishnamurti & the Art of Awakening
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Ravi Seth's Forum Activity | 1625 posts in 3 forums


Forum: General Discussion Tue, 18 Jan 2011
Topic: A Wrong Turn

Kapila Kulasinghe wrote: Ravi, I didn't understand Eve's statement to mean this.

Self is causing conflict between man & man right? We can see that, isn't it? So it's possible to say the building up of the 'self' is a wrong action as far as peace between man & man is concerned.So we can say it's the wrong turn.My question then is why did man do that? That is, why did man build the 'self'? How do you say this question doesn't follow or cannot follow from the point we made before?

Read 'k'.He says it all.For that matter read Eve again, she also says it more clearly referring to your post:

"Perhaps because the ending of the self, ego which is knowledge as the past feels like death and translated as the death of the organism. If you every experienced ending anything, the ego often reacts to it by fear. To die each day to the past means death. The organism equates the ending of the self, as a physical death."

Forum: General Discussion Tue, 18 Jan 2011
Topic: A Wrong Turn

Dr.sudhir sharma wrote: While reading your response, I was keenly looking at my own reactions and responses, never trying to understand/criticise what you were saying. This is my understanding of K's teachings.

When you keenly look at your response and also hear what the other is saying is a two way process.Why can't you be only with the listening without any response or reaction of yours?

Dr.sudhir sharma wrote: Your wanting to understand the meaning of my words instead of looking at your own reactions while reading my post, in my understanding of these matters, is to perpetuate darkness.

I said i was confused utterly in listening to your words and i am seeing my confusion which is my response in the same way as you observe your response in listening to the other.( as you say in the first reply as above)

You also say in your previous post that, "I will comment on this after you have explained the meaning and significance of 'logic' as you understand it." Here you are also trying to understand the meaning of my words instead just looking at your reactions but you must again pontificate that ,"in my understanding of these matters, is to perpetuate darkness." What the hell are you doing Doctor?

See!!!!!

Forum: General Discussion Tue, 18 Jan 2011
Topic: A Wrong Turn

Dr.sudhir sharma wrote: Living states and movements can not be described, friend.

Living states and movements can be described.

Dr.sudhir sharma wrote: I am going to ask quite a lot of questions from you. So, be patient, please.

welcome

Forum: General Discussion Wed, 19 Jan 2011
Topic: A Wrong Turn

Dr.sudhir sharma wrote: Can they be described in a way that the description will give a taste of them to reader/listener? Something like giving joy of swimming to another by description without him getting his feet wet? How is this miracle performed, friend?

When did i say they can?The problem with you Doc is, you assume too much.But yes,they can point out for sure.

Forum: General Discussion Wed, 19 Jan 2011
Topic: A Wrong Turn

Dr.sudhir sharma wrote: Don't waste time with this, please.

Thank God! I am relieved!

Dr.sudhir sharma wrote: Stay first with the quote from your post (no. 52) below and then let the discussion proceed

.......so you instruct me a la 'k' style to remain with my confusion!!!!!!! :-)

Dear Doc, I have played this chess when i was a kid.No mood now to play it again.Sorry.

Forum: General Discussion Wed, 19 Jan 2011
Topic: A Wrong Turn

gb

you are hitting the nail on the head!!

Don't be so cruel but do it ahista , ahista (jhatka nahi but halaal) :-)

Forum: General Discussion Wed, 19 Jan 2011
Topic: A Wrong Turn

Kapila Kulasinghe wrote: Can a living state be described?

pl read gb's comments in previous post # 57.

Forum: General Discussion Thu, 20 Jan 2011
Topic: A Wrong Turn

Dr.sudhir sharma wrote: The above is from post no. 55. In it 'can be described' becomes 'they can point out' which is a totally different thing.

I thought you were a 'k' listener or reader.Here it is understood that description is not the described.You are confusing where there was no confusion at the first place, Doc.

Forum: General Discussion Thu, 20 Jan 2011
Topic: A Wrong Turn

Dr.sudhir sharma wrote: Your assumption that gb (a thourough gentleman) was being cruel to me is pathetic

It is a political statement by you.

Forum: General Discussion Thu, 20 Jan 2011
Topic: A Wrong Turn

Dr.sudhir sharma wrote: What do you feel about the commentaries on living by K? May be those states beyond (if any) can not be described gb

In 'commentaries on living' 'k' describes such states which are beyond.Also at many a times, at many a places he has described these states i.e..... 'i woke up meditating'.... 'ground which is the most rational'............'nothingness is this whole universe'

These states can well be described which is in a sense pointing towards something though it is understood that description is not described.

Dr.sudhir sharma wrote: The next line and the smiley at the end of your post shows us a (so far) hidden aspect of your nature I wouldn't like to comment upon.

I put my unconditional apology to you for smiling which you rightly pointed out and i also saw this low trait of mine and assure you it is dropped of my psyche the moment i saw it.

Forum: General Discussion Thu, 20 Jan 2011
Topic: Does one know why they are participating in this forum?

Eve Goodmon wrote: One of the things living in Asia taught me was patience and the ability to to be stupid....:)

That was a good one, eve. :-)

Forum: General Discussion Thu, 20 Jan 2011
Topic: A Wrong Turn

Ravi Seth wrote: Also at many a times, at many a places he has described these states i.e..... 'i woke up meditating'.... 'ground which is the most rational'............'nothingness is this whole universe'

These states can well be described which is in a sense pointing towards something though it is understood that description is not described.

Kapila

pl read above.

Forum: General Discussion Thu, 20 Jan 2011
Topic: A Wrong Turn

Kapila Kulasinghe wrote: We are referring to states of mind which are changing so fast that the quality of it cannot be said to be anything for a substantial period to warrant description.

Again you are talking abt quality.Quality of sugar is that it tastes sweet.No body can describe what is "actually" sweet unless one tastes it but one can describe it in general terms pointing out to one that there is something else than the normal taste which one has never tasted. Then in his pointing out that sweetness visible is the sweetness of his description though it is not the actual .That is why we are after 'k's teaching because we see something which is of order... in his sayings, in his dialog..his known meaning the way he presents his seeing... seems to be full of order and by which we wonder and also feel attracted to listen.

One may not be able even to describe that quality, that perfume in words.But words do come after sometime to describe, to share with the others.This is what 'k' was doing throughout his life... only having dialog, discourse and sometimes also giving description of "that".

Forum: General Discussion Fri, 21 Jan 2011
Topic: A Wrong Turn

Dr.sudhir sharma wrote: ............and this is not a politically motivated compliment

:-)

Forum: General Discussion Fri, 21 Jan 2011
Topic: A Wrong Turn

Eve Goodmon wrote: Taking the political risk again....don't you know when you are inattentive? Is one not aware when psychological or ego based thinking is occurring? The wrong turn is simply when one uses the tool of thinking in areas where it is not needed and the results are suffering and confusion....the consequences of these actions and thoughts are the KNOWING.

Our thinking and memory has consequences....disorder.

The question was put by me days earlier.I have just got some different flash before i read your statement and working on it to express the same in words but unrelated with your statement above.Wait till then. I might say something totally different when i come back.Till then.

Forum: General Discussion Fri, 21 Jan 2011
Topic: A Wrong Turn

Kapila Kulasinghe wrote: That is, it is not in the field of knowing.It can only be lived

If it can be lived , it is known.( meaning that it can be sensed and can be described as such)

Quote anything which is lived and not known....... or may be you have some different meaning of the word "live" than the usual or dictionary meaning.

Forum: General Discussion Fri, 21 Jan 2011
Topic: inclusion rather than exclusion

Eve Goodmon wrote: Fourth is the solar plexus right? What do you mean not hit by two things? Why is it the sound of energy? You start the OM with the A U M sounds right?

as per hindu scriptures ( describing chakras):

4rth center is - anahata (region of the heart), of the element Air (breath, spiritus, prana) and anahata is the sound unheard by the physical ear but can be heard only when OM is the sound after when everything else disappears from your being - no thought, no dream, no projections, no expectations, not even a single ripple - your whole lake of consciousness is simply silent; it has become just a mirror. In those rare moments you hear the sound of silence. It is the most valuable experience because it not only shows a quality of the inner music - it also shows that the inner is full of harmony, joy, blissfulness. All that is implied in the music of OM - the sound of energy.

Ordinary sound is produced when two things are hit together.Thats simple.

Forum: General Discussion Tue, 25 Jan 2011
Topic: sorrow

dhirendra singh wrote: Dear Eve, surrender demand freedom to act, I am not free to act

Surrender is when all escape routes are closed and all tries whatever don't do nothing.Absolute Full Sop whatsoever in the known to get off.Then there is no choice left but to surrender....and that moment of surrendering is free from the prison.

Forum: General Discussion Tue, 25 Jan 2011
Topic: sorrow

come out of theories, dhiru bhai.... not ideas but actuality of surrender....thats why when all escape routes close (when no ideas remain), you die ...... but physical death won't release you from this since you didn't surrender while living.... you will continue to live another, then another, then another life till you surrender, therefore why not now?

Forum: General Discussion Wed, 26 Jan 2011
Topic: sorrow

dhirendra singh wrote: It look like, not only Dhiru Bhai, but also Ravi Bhai is good in making theories, but dhiru bhai think his theories are just theories, but Ravi bhai thinks that his theories are facts.:)

beautifully said.Thats it.

Forum: General Discussion Wed, 26 Jan 2011
Topic: Dear Krishnaji, no how and no where,we can't do it? Why?

Eve Goodmon wrote: Today is it different? Are we willing to give it all up? With no direction no security and no guarantee?

Even if it is beyond us, still we can live dangerously purposely , say to "test the teachings" even not understanding it fully.Dangerously say in small matters, small things, if not big and everything and let go of the attachment completely to small matters say abt "hurts" or say abt money and observe what happens, just for the fun sake, not wanting, hoping for any results positive or negative, not acting as a reaction, seeing the reaction and letting it go howsoever insecure we feel abt it, with no direction no security and no guarantee actually and not intellectually.Acting naturally as if the attachment for that thing never existed for us.

I think it can be done in no time or even if we fail first time, try it for second, third, fourth or so on till we are convinced we did no wrong in action as suggested by the teaching.It all relates to us and no body else.We don't have to find a guru outside to listen to a method, the method is within us all, the sadguru within, the greatest of all the scientist, and it doesn't cost a penny . :)

This is only the way to touch and test the teachings.If we say afterwards, it is all piece of crap, throw it overboard .

Forum: General Discussion Thu, 27 Jan 2011
Topic: Dear Krishnaji, no how and no where,we can't do it? Why?

yes, i am ............but there is a punjabi idiom , " main te chaddar nu chadna chahna han per chaddar mainu nahi chaddi"

meaning :I want to leave the comfortable quilt but the quilt doesn't leave me. :-)

Forum: General Discussion Fri, 28 Jan 2011
Topic: Freedom

ayar hari wrote: Freedom from what? If I am tied to a pole, then I want freedom from being tied to that pole.

The body I inhabit stops me from doing things I want to do. I am stuck to my body like a goat tied to a pole. So, it is possible for me to say what freedom is. There is no need for me to find out for I know what it is

When you come to the edge of all the light you know,

and are about to step off into the darkness of the unknown,

faith is knowing one of two things will happen:

There will be something solid to stand on,

or you will be taught how to fly.

Death is Nothing at All

Forum: General Discussion Sat, 29 Jan 2011
Topic: I have an overwhelming feeling that I am K reincarnated.

Gomez says:'At the end of the day, whatever real was within Krishnamurti is whithin Kerrie and I and you. Only that matters.'

mina says: Great, exactly!

In Chandogya Upanishad Sage Aruni to Shvetaketu his son, says 'Tat tvam asi' 'That thou are'.

meaning:

That Brahman which is the common Reality behind everything in the cosmos is the same as the essential Divinity, namely the Atman, within you.

Does this above, the meaning of what you say , Gomez? or Mina, is it what you understand by Gomez's statement?

Forum: General Discussion Sat, 29 Jan 2011
Topic: agreeing & disadreeing are they acts of violence ?

Dr.sudhir sharma wrote: Do you see it like this?

Doc, I am sorry to intervene.Eve may or may not see it like this.But I am sure I don't.

I am also aware that if I say I don't see what 'k' said I will be seen as a fool who after spending years on 'k' haven't been able to have an insight into what is so obvious. What you are saying is not anything different though paraphrasing what 'k' said and no body can find fault in what you say or may be, it is your direct insight.No body can question you in both the cases.

But the kind of fool I am, I am asking you what is it, Doc? Your direct insight or you trying to fit into the teachings?

Forum: General Discussion Sat, 29 Jan 2011
Topic: I have an overwhelming feeling that I am K reincarnated.

Juan Illan Gomez wrote: Very much so, my friend.

you mina?

Forum: General Discussion Sun, 30 Jan 2011
Topic: Effects of K teachings

dhirendra singh wrote: Idea of separation is a real garbage filled bin

ayar hari wrote: Is the separation an illusion?

ayar hari wrote: I am the world but India is something else.

Your discussions are getting interesting and absorbing.Why don't you two meet face to face in India?We are holding a retreat sort of meeting in June this year in Himalayas.This is serious.You two are cordially invited.

See the 'events' sub section on kinofnet if you are interested ( under At The Foothills Of Giants.)

Forum: General Discussion Sun, 30 Jan 2011
Topic: agreeing & disadreeing are they acts of violence ?

Dr.sudhir sharma wrote: Never give direct answers (specially when they are unnecessary and have no significance to the topic under discussion) when there is a chance that it will disturb the peace of mind of a friend.:-)

In matters of "TRUTH" why to restrain yourself in giving direct answers?No friends and no peace of mind talk.Let the mind of a friend or xyz get disturbed and not be in a fool's paradise, only then he has a chance to see what you see.Rather you would be doing a service to him when you show him the mirror.Therefore doc, I demand that.

And in a forum where everybody is participating you are supposed to explain what you say when asked.This is decent and called etiquettes of any dialog.So speak please what has been asked and don't dilly dally.

Forum: General Discussion Mon, 31 Jan 2011
Topic: agreeing & disadreeing are they acts of violence ?

Lord Krishna, Lord of Lords and 16 kala sampoorn died a commoner's death.

J krishnamurti said all his life time he was not a freak meaning he was just like everybody of us and not an extraordinary person.

To judge such a person otherwise that too on social taboos or social traditions or conditioning is foolishness.

There is an interesting incident that happened with me in my town.One rich industrialist known to be a staunch Hindu and a scholar of Vedas called me to his office many years back and at the time when Sloss's book had just been published.He was sitting there with his cronies and handed me smilingly few of the news papers where some description of Sloss's book was printed and asked me what was my reaction.

I said may be after some time all of them would ask me what was the soap 'k' washed his hands with after he came out of toilet.Was that an Savon de Marseille soap or the desi one? How can i reply to such stupid questions?Moreover Kabir has all ready said: GURU ki karni guru jayega, chele ki karni chela.( Guru is responsible for his own actions and the pupil for his own) Why should i worry over or even judge Guru's doings? I am only concerned with if I was living the teaching or not.Thats all.

Forum: General Discussion Mon, 31 Jan 2011
Topic: What aspects did J.K. not fully cover in his teaching?

ganesan balachandran wrote: fate? GB

He did that too.... somewhere he said, 'if one is a sensitive person and see two boats miles apart but coming into each other and every possibility of a definite collision and says so, whats so great about it?'