Krishnamurti & the Art of Awakening
General Discussion | moderated by Dev Singh

Actions by Krishnamurti As Teachings


Displaying all 30 posts
Page 1 of 1
Mon, 13 Dec 2010 #1
Thumb_avatar idiot ? United States 649 posts in this forum Offline

There are certain actions that K took that I also take and consider very important:


  • Eat vegetarian.

  • Sit in silent meditation with a naturally quiet mind.

  • Walk in nature.

  • Talk with people about important issues.

Do you also do these things? Which of them? Do you consider these important? Which? Why or why not?

Of course, to blindly copy the actions of a person is to take them as an authority, just as much as blindly following the verbal teachings of a person is. Yet won't insight into life naturally lead one into actions like the above?

Are actions as important as words as teaching? Are any actions by K teachings?

Of course, action can be by choice, by volition, or it can flow without idea, from silent awareness, from love. The four actions I cite above could arise either way (with the possible exception of natural, silent meditation). If you live without choice, do actions like the above happen? Or if you live by choice, can you choose compassionate actions, or does choice always sully action? If choice always contaminates action, does that give me an excuse to act badly and uncaringly?

This post was last updated by idiot ? Mon, 13 Dec 2010.

Sign in to recommend  This post has been recommended by 1 reader
Back to Top
Tue, 14 Dec 2010 #2
Thumb_tampura ganesan balachandran India 2204 posts in this forum Offline

idiot ? wrote:
Talk with people about important issues.

Occasionally i discuss with my friends on the message of JK without mentioning his name, like the present is the only reality, looking things without any images and when i speak to them with involvement i could see their feeling of silence and joy. Continuously i have been sending daily quote appear here. three of my friends after a year all of a sudden acknowledged me. There are many more. Thank you for the opportunity to share. The only action is i talk with them very clearly.
gb

We are watching, not waiting, not expecting anything to happen but watching without end. JK

Sign in to recommend
Back to Top
Tue, 14 Dec 2010 #3
Thumb_avatar idiot ? United States 649 posts in this forum Offline

ganesan balachandran wrote:
Occasionally i discuss with my friends on the message of JK without mentioning his name...

Yes, and of course, we are discussing issues here online, too.

Another action K talked about and put into practice was to "put your house in order". I think he meant this both figuratively and literally. I am not a slob but I'm not a total neatnik either. My home is mostly clean and yet there is also a small level of disorder, too. I think K lived in very orderly places, although he himself probably wasn't doing the cleaning all the time. So in this regard, I'm not a K clone.

This post was last updated by idiot ? Tue, 14 Dec 2010.

Sign in to recommend
Back to Top
Tue, 14 Dec 2010 #4
Thumb_img_7089_copy Eve G. Indonesia 1570 posts in this forum Offline

Hi Idiot....no offense meant...I can't help wonder why you chose this term but ok, I accept. I think K meant the house on the inside but he was a man of order both on the inside and the outside as I remember him.

Actually, most of the neat freaks I know tend to clean the outside as a substitute for putting the inside house in order, so one can never tell about things like that. Just like a workaholic is not working to bring about world change but to escape his own disorder.

So where are we? We need to stop eating animals, take walks in woods and get some space.... I read someplace that Hitler was a vegetarian, he loved animals and was one of the firs to preserve the Bavarian forest....makes me wonder about following formulas. As for speaking with serious people on this forum or elsewhere....back to our forum about discussion being a total waste of time :D.

The nature of the change from disorder is silence.

Sign in to recommend
Back to Top
Tue, 14 Dec 2010 #5
Thumb_1507053_1_ Jayaraj Kapila Kulasinghe Sri Lanka 1208 posts in this forum Offline

idiot ? wrote:
Do you also do these things? Which of them? Do you consider these important? Which? Why or why not?

Yes, I do.All four.I consider these to be extremely important & vital.

Why- 1)I think there cannot be sensitivity if we harm life.Harming has to be minimal I think-plants etc.Otherwise there is aggression & violence.

2)I observe myself in relationship as well as sitting quietly & watching the mind.I find this sitting with the back straight & watching to be an astonishing thing.I do not practice any method.I just watch my mind whatever takes place without reacting.It just calms down the mind! And if you keep watching & watching & watching you certainly begin to see the nature of the mind which is not an outcome of thinking. It's amazing-such a seeing is there.

3)Actually whole meaning of life must be lying here although we are missing it altogether.I go for a walk daily.Sometimes the nature is so beautiful you feel you don't want anything more in life.If we are ambitious, ridden with desire then we cannot see this.I have also observed at moments you see the beauty around only you have the ability to be affectionate-although desire is in abeyance. This is to me one of the highest gifts I got studying K.This is inseparable as you explore the teachings I think.K once said about transformation his long walks might have also had something to do with it.

4)This is utterly important too I think.I discuss whenever the opportunity arises.Once a friend came & started arguing with me about observation.To my understanding he was saying something incorrect.I listened with my whole being to make a break through.Whole day it went on.I could not point out to him but the following day I thought I had got liberated!That discussion & listening had a tremendous impact although the point was not correct.

Sign in to recommend
Back to Top
Tue, 14 Dec 2010 #6
Thumb_tampura ganesan balachandran India 2204 posts in this forum Offline

Kapila Kulasinghe wrote:
To my understanding he was saying something incorrect.I listened with my whole being to make a break through.Whole day it went on.I could not point out to him but the following day I thought I had got liberated!

!

:)
gb

We are watching, not waiting, not expecting anything to happen but watching without end. JK

Sign in to recommend
Back to Top
Tue, 14 Dec 2010 #7
Thumb_1507053_1_ Jayaraj Kapila Kulasinghe Sri Lanka 1208 posts in this forum Offline

idiot ? wrote:
If you live without choice, do actions like the above happen?

You can do it Idiot.You can take that action without it being a choice if you are clear of the implications.You are clear therefore you do it.It's not a choice then.Choice means you have not seen the implications & therefore have options to choose.

Sign in to recommend
Back to Top
Tue, 14 Dec 2010 #8
Thumb_avatar idiot ? United States 649 posts in this forum Offline

Eve Goodmon wrote:
So where are we? We need to stop eating animals, take walks in woods and get some space.... I read someplace that Hitler was a vegetarian....makes me wonder about following formulas.

Well, as I said, these things, vegetarianism, sitting meditation, nature walking, and discussion, may arise by following models/authority or naturally as one discovers.

You seem to dismiss them quite quickly. It is true that Hitler was a veg. But K also did these things. Do you think they are unimportant things that he did? Like the fancy brand of shoes he liked to wear? To me, these are beautiful and vitally important activities. To me, they are not incidental at all to K teaching but essential expressions of it.

Part of what got me to start this thread is the question in the Kinfonet questionnaire about making the teachings practicable. To me these are highly practical aspects of the teaching that naturally flow from a sensitive life.

Sign in to recommend
Back to Top
Tue, 14 Dec 2010 #9
Thumb_avatar idiot ? United States 649 posts in this forum Offline

Kapila Kulasinghe wrote:
Yes, I do.All four.I consider these to be extremely important & vital.

I have to say that I am very happy to hear that, Kapila. Like you, I consider these four things extremely important and vital. It is no accident that K did these things and they naturally flow out of insight into life.

Sometimes I feel very different from other people. Lots of people, including lots of people interested in K, do not feel that things like this are so important. I'm sure that you and I are quite different in many ways. But we seem to be quite in agreement about these matters.

Part of my understanding of "You are the world" is that we are all not so different. Of course, we are all unique in many particulars. But in many ways, we share the same suffering, dissatisfaction, joy, and so on. That is how we can understand and relate to one another. And yet, even though at base we may not be so different, I rarely encounter someone who deeply values vegetarianism, real meditation, walks in nature and discussion of matters like this. There's a strange and beautiful aloneness, to be together with everyone and everything, and yet...

Sign in to recommend  This post has been recommended by 1 reader
Back to Top
Wed, 15 Dec 2010 #10
Thumb_1507053_1_ Jayaraj Kapila Kulasinghe Sri Lanka 1208 posts in this forum Offline

Eve Goodmon wrote:
.makes me wonder about following formulas.

Eve,

Is it a formula not to kill? Isn't it a question of sensitivity?

Yes,Hitler was a vegetarian.So this means his reason was not due to sensitivity judging by his infamous deeds.Let us then consider some people who were considered sensitive.

1)The 6th commandment(or some other) of the Bible is- Thou shall not kill-if I am not mistaken.

2)1st precept in Buddhist scriptures say not to kill.The Buddha also had said to abstain from selling flesh as a profession.

3) It is prohibited in Koran(traditional chapter 2,verse 173)to eat dead flesh.blood,swine. Special emphasis had been given to swine for some reason but dead flesh means meat & fish.Furthermore how to eat meat & fish without eating blood?

So apparently the saints of these 3 religions did not advocate eating meat & fish although nobody-the Buddhists, the Christians or Muslims- follow it.Hindus don't eat flesh- if I am correct.

So this what the saints said.

This post was last updated by Jayaraj Kapila Kulasinghe Thu, 16 Dec 2010.

Sign in to recommend
Back to Top
Wed, 15 Dec 2010 #11
Thumb_avatar Ravi Seth India 1573 posts in this forum Offline

idiot ? wrote:
There are certain actions that K took that I also take and consider very important:

Eat vegetarian.

'k' used to eat eggs

Sign in to recommend
Back to Top
Wed, 15 Dec 2010 #12
Thumb_tampura ganesan balachandran India 2204 posts in this forum Offline

Ravi Seth wrote:
'k' used to eat eggs

what is the source of information about this? However my question is what will those people do where there is not much vegetation?
gb
gb

We are watching, not waiting, not expecting anything to happen but watching without end. JK

Sign in to recommend
Back to Top
Wed, 15 Dec 2010 #13
Thumb_avatar Ravi Seth India 1573 posts in this forum Offline

ganesan balachandran wrote:
what is the source of information about this? However my question is what will those people do where there is not much vegetation? gb

I will find the link and let you know.My information is correct.You can see in the 'k' schools eggs are provided to children.

Thinking aloud, even when I was not in contact with the teachings,I saw it is not the question of being a vegetarian or non - vegetarian.We human beings who are vegetarian also kill plants and the plants also have life in them.One therefore must see that one preferably eats only that which is less evolved.Plants are less evolved than the animals.When there is a choice between animals and plants one should eat plants instead of animals.Simple logic and mmmmm ... may be not correct... well i don't know for sure!... lion kills other animals and eat it too and it is not considered as violence......... well i am really confused...
the nature brings disasters like tsunami,earth quake , floods etc.... the cruelty of which kills millions. Is man exactly in the image of nature?

or is it not about the violence inside us which makes us do that.. the killing... for taste ... and for so called nutrition value..our own selfishness and then we form that habit and go on and on and when someone questions we either try to justify or do not listen at all.

This post was last updated by Ravi Seth Wed, 15 Dec 2010.

Sign in to recommend
Back to Top
Wed, 15 Dec 2010 #14
Thumb_tampura ganesan balachandran India 2204 posts in this forum Offline

It is a question based on necessity and availability rather than on taste. Natural disasters have got link with emotions. Tao of Physics dealt with that i think.That time when tsunami occurred certain section of the people on whole were emotionally disturbed.
gb

We are watching, not waiting, not expecting anything to happen but watching without end. JK

Sign in to recommend
Back to Top
Wed, 15 Dec 2010 #15
Thumb_avatar Ravi Seth India 1573 posts in this forum Offline

ganesan balachandran wrote:
Natural disasters have got link with emotions. Tao of Physics dealt with that i think.That time when tsunami occurred certain section of the people on whole were emotionally disturbed. gb

forget abt tao of physics ( any way i found it too boring)
Do you say since many a people were emotionally disturbed in certain regions, those very regions were the ones where tsunami occurred?

and if yes, could you kindly enumerate and elaborate your thinking ?

Sign in to recommend
Back to Top
Thu, 16 Dec 2010 #16
Thumb_1507053_1_ Jayaraj Kapila Kulasinghe Sri Lanka 1208 posts in this forum Offline

Ravi Seth wrote:
When there is a choice between animals and plants one should eat plants instead of animals.Simple logic and mmmmm ... may be not correct... well i don't know for sure!..

We can be very simple here Ravi.Leave aside the animals. We have enough intelligence to understand killing causes pain, fear & so on.That's enough I think.

Sign in to recommend
Back to Top
Thu, 16 Dec 2010 #17
Thumb_tampura ganesan balachandran India 2204 posts in this forum Offline

Ravi Seth wrote:
those very regions

not those very region, but those region also to some extent. i will elaborate once i go back to Tao of physics. Haileys comet appeared while JK died.
gb

We are watching, not waiting, not expecting anything to happen but watching without end. JK

Sign in to recommend
Back to Top
Thu, 16 Dec 2010 #18
Thumb_img_7089_copy Eve G. Indonesia 1570 posts in this forum Offline

idiot ? wrote:
You seem to dismiss them quite quickly. It is true that Hitler was a veg. But K also did these things. Do you think they are unimportant things that he did? Like the fancy brand of shoes he liked to wear? To me, these are beautiful and vitally important activities. To me, they are not incidental at all to K teaching but essential expressions of it.

You seem to put words in mouth and come to conclusions just as quickly...K and others come to vegetarianism through a deep understanding of the interconnected life and the relationship between humans and animals...many people are vegetarians and practice violence in their life each day while using vegetarianism as a flag...I am not comparing K and Hitler. Please comparing is part of that violence we are speaking on. I am saying that just practicing based on authority or fads, is just as much none sense as killing and eating animals and sometimes worse.

The nature of the change from disorder is silence.

Sign in to recommend
Back to Top
Thu, 16 Dec 2010 #19
Thumb_tampura ganesan balachandran India 2204 posts in this forum Offline

Ravi Seth wrote:
and if yes, could you kindly enumerate and elaborate your thinking ?

equilibrium is like a ballon and once you compress some part violently the other part explodes. right.
gb

We are watching, not waiting, not expecting anything to happen but watching without end. JK

Sign in to recommend
Back to Top
Thu, 16 Dec 2010 #20
Thumb_img_7089_copy Eve G. Indonesia 1570 posts in this forum Offline

Kapila Kulasinghe wrote:
Is it a formula not to kill? Isn't it a question of sensitivity?

Yes,Hitler was a vegetarian.So this means his reason was not due to sensitivity judging by his infamous deeds.Let us then consider some people who were considered sensitive.

1)The 6th commandment(or some other) of the Bible is- Thou shall not kill-if I am not mistaken.

2)1st precept in Buddhist scriptures say not to kill.The Buddha also had said to abstain from selling flesh as a profession.

3) It is prohibited in Koran(traditional chapter 2,verse 173)to eat dead flesh.blood,swine. Special emphasis had been given to swine for some reason but dead flesh means meat & fish.Furthermore how to eat meat & fish without eating blood?

So apparently the saints of these 3 religions did not advocate eating meat & fish although nobody-the Buddhists, the Christians or Muslims- follow it.Hindus don't eat flesh- if I am correct.

So this what the saints said.

Sir

Do you kill in word or gesture? Do you dominate, compare all part of the cycle of violence?

So you follow authority also part of violence?

I am not interested in what K said or didn't say or scripture...I am interested in understanding life and why one does and does not do something not based on what others say or don't say. As for my self I come from a third generation vegetarianism. So my grandfather who was a close friend of K was a vegetarian and so was my father and I.

I came to understand that one can it well without the shedding of blood and that is and understanding I practice. But following without understanding, while practicing violence in many other forms and never being aware of it, is what we all do. Yet we continue to wave the flag of vegetarianism. This a privet action one my choose to live by and not something to make political statements about.

One is only questioning the hypocritical nature of the self...:)

The nature of the change from disorder is silence.

Sign in to recommend
Back to Top
Fri, 17 Dec 2010 #21
Thumb_1507053_1_ Jayaraj Kapila Kulasinghe Sri Lanka 1208 posts in this forum Offline

Eve Goodmon wrote:
So my grandfather who was a close friend of K was a vegetarian and so was my father and I.

Your post #4 gave me the impression that you consider non killing of animals to be a formula which prompted me to answer your post as I do not consider so.Apparently I have misunderstood.I apologize to you for any offence.

Eve Goodmon wrote:
This a privet action one my choose to live by and not something to make political statements about.

Do you mind if I comment on this please? I do not agree at all this to be a private action we may choose but a fact without choice as we inquire into life but I agree that this is not a thing to make political statements about.

This post was last updated by Jayaraj Kapila Kulasinghe Fri, 17 Dec 2010.

Sign in to recommend
Back to Top
Fri, 17 Dec 2010 #22
Thumb_img_7089_copy Eve G. Indonesia 1570 posts in this forum Offline

Kapila Kulasinghe wrote:
Do you mind if I comment on this please? I do not agree at all this to be a private action we may choose but a fact without choice as we inquire into life but I agree that this is not a thing to make political statements about.

People are vegetarian from many reasons...for some it is a fad, for others it is a choice, others it is for health reasons, habit, political correctness etc. This is what I meant it is a personal 'choice' born of awareness that killing is not necessary. I do not in any way see myself better than meat eaters, or more advanced at all because I still have the self in tact and that self creates many acts of violence so for as long as the I is in tact, I find it very hypocritical to tell anyone what they should eat or not eat :) I am not at all offended but simply stating that people wave flags and formulas as the road to enlightenment that often seem hypocritical that is all.:)

The nature of the change from disorder is silence.

Sign in to recommend
Back to Top
Fri, 17 Dec 2010 #23
Thumb_tampura ganesan balachandran India 2204 posts in this forum Offline

Ravi Seth wrote:
forget abt tao of physics

Do you feel some specialists fields also need to be questioned, though
need not be taken as authority.
gb

We are watching, not waiting, not expecting anything to happen but watching without end. JK

Sign in to recommend
Back to Top
Fri, 17 Dec 2010 #24
Thumb_avatar Ravi Seth India 1573 posts in this forum Offline

ganesan balachandran wrote:
Do you feel some specialists fields also need to be questioned, though need not be taken as authority. gb

In case you are interested to have some scientific base ( because i believe you are an engineer like i am and would not accept something having no real scientific base) which indicates to whatever we all have been discussing ,pl read the following:

1.Crucible of Consciousness
by Zoltan Torey

2.The Feeling of what happens-Body and Emotion in making of Consciousness
by Antonio Damasio

3.Go to wiki page , 'Karl H. Pribram' and read the hologram theory and the links there

4.Read Bohm & all of his books and also http://twm.co.nz/hologram.html

After reading it you will find how true 'k' was despite having no scientific background and how truly & logically he dissected the human mind! It is really a wonder!

All the above have been authenticated by reputed institutes except there is still controversy in accepting Bohm's and Pribram theories as they have yet not been demonstrated physically but the science doesn't have any other explanation till date which encompasses the whole compared to what Bohm and Pribram have logically given.Zoltan however proves with all the scientific data that 'I' does not exists at all but is only an outcome of evolution which gave Humans a highly evolved tool i.e. language which the animals do not have and 'I', what we feel is just a mirage.It is really very interesting!

This post was last updated by Ravi Seth Fri, 17 Dec 2010.

Sign in to recommend
Back to Top
Sun, 19 Dec 2010 #25
Thumb_avatar idiot ? United States 649 posts in this forum Offline

One of the reasons I started this thread is that I was reading all the answers to the Kinfonet interview question about whether the teachings could be made more practical. I discovered and very much appreciated the answer by prasad mulupuri, someone who became a kinfonet member, answered some interview questions and then vanished without posting in the forums. His answer is at:
http://www.kinfonet.org/profiles/520-prasad-mul...
and begins: "Krishnaji is nothing if he is not "practicable"." And then he lists a number of practical K teachings.

This got me thinking about K's actions as teachings.

Sign in to recommend
Back to Top
Sun, 19 Dec 2010 #26
Thumb_img_7089_copy Eve G. Indonesia 1570 posts in this forum Offline

"Krishnaji is nothing if he is not "practicable".May be this question crops up because he said there is no path toTruth.Once you see the validity of this statement,Krishnaji becomes eminently "practicable"
.There are sso many "practical" tips thrown up by Krishnaji like the following:
Take vegetarian food.
Give up meat and wine and smoking.
Do'nt make a problem of sex.
Keep the body execised and sensitive.
Observe the squalidity and grind of life around.
See how you grovel before the boss and how you kick the underdog.
Once he said "none of you will be here to hear me if you get an invitation from the President for dinner."
See how little generosity you have.
Attention is when you see your inattention.
Pain is the attempt to avoid pain.
Hope is hell.
A post does not give status,it gives only a function.
A printed book has no special authority.
When you lose relationship with nature, you lose relationship with man.
When you are short of space in a cramped city,you should ,at least, have a silent or spacious mind.
Such are the practical or practicable clues thrown up by Krishnaji, not to mention other more powerful or inimitable statements made by him like that the national flag is an ugly rag or that Catholics are great acquires of real estate or that the West went to the colonies with Bible in one hand and the bayonet in the other or that the Gurus from the East come with their bag of tricks or that the Rishis are immature human beings or that he did not belong to the Brahmin tribe"

I have posted it here because as you say it is both true and it is very practical. The problem I have with this, is that if you follow anyone including the practical advise of a sage, you do not come to this through your understanding you are simply following someone else path and imitating someones way of life which is a form of violence.

The nature of the change from disorder is silence.

Sign in to recommend
Back to Top
Mon, 20 Dec 2010 #27
Thumb_tampura ganesan balachandran India 2204 posts in this forum Offline

Eve Goodmon wrote:
you are simply following someone else path and imitating someones way of life which is a form of violence.

yes, but this come naturally with the understanding of JK's factual messages.
gb

We are watching, not waiting, not expecting anything to happen but watching without end. JK

Sign in to recommend
Back to Top
Mon, 20 Dec 2010 #28
Thumb_stringio nick carter United States 777 posts in this forum ACCOUNT DELETED

Eve Goodmon wrote:
Observe the squalidity and grind of life around

Squalor I've observed, but "squalidity"?

Sign in to recommend
Back to Top
Tue, 21 Dec 2010 #29
Thumb_avatar idiot ? United States 649 posts in this forum Offline

nick carter wrote:
Squalor I've observed, but "squalidity"?

Obviously, Mr. prasad mulupuri, whom Eve Goodmon is quoting, is not perfect in his English, punctuation, etc. Of much more importance are his ideas, yes?

Sign in to recommend
Back to Top
Tue, 21 Dec 2010 #30
Thumb_stringio nick carter United States 777 posts in this forum ACCOUNT DELETED

idiot ? wrote:
Obviously, Mr. prasad mulupuri, whom Eve Goodmon is quoting, is not perfect in his English, punctuation, etc. Of much more importance are his ideas, yes?

Apart from his list of K-isms, what exactly are "his ideas"?

Sign in to recommend
Back to Top
Displaying all 30 posts
Page 1 of 1
To quote a portion of this post in your reply, first select the text and then click this "Quote" link.

(N.B. Be sure to insert an empty line between the quoted text and your reply.)