Krishnamurti & the Art of Awakening
General Discussion | moderated by Dev Singh

What is the ground on which inner silence may come about?


Displaying posts 91 - 120 of 201 in total
Wed, 03 Apr 2019 #91
Thumb_father-jack jamie f United Kingdom 10 posts in this forum Offline

One Self wrote:
There is no violence in this chatroom.

My point is that you cannot see this clearly because you are part of it - we all are.

One Self wrote:
Seeing false as false is the highest intelligence.

Seeing the false as false is to see the truth in which case I refer you to my point above.

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Wed, 03 Apr 2019 #92
Thumb_father-jack jamie f United Kingdom 10 posts in this forum Offline

It is probably best to avoid definitive statements, even if you're Krishnamurti.

Jack Pine wrote:
"There is in fact only one state, not two states such as the conscious and the unconscious." J.Krishnamurti: The Book Of Life, September 27.

One Self wrote:
"There is conscious sorrow, and there is also unconscious sorrow." The Book of Life, July 14,

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f2DVcX7QKIo

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Wed, 03 Apr 2019 #93
Thumb_screenshot_20180710-010635 One Self United States 1053 posts in this forum Offline

violence (?va??l?ns)
n
1. the exercise or an instance of physical force, usually effecting or intended to effect injuries, destruction, etc
2. powerful, untamed, or devastating force: the violence of the sea.
3. great strength of feeling, as in language, etc; fervour
4. an unjust, unwarranted, or unlawful display of force, esp such as tends to overawe or intimidate
5. do violence to
a. to inflict harm upon; damage or violate: they did violence to the prisoners.
b. to distort or twist the sense or intention of: the reporters did violence to my speech.
[C13: via Old French from Latin violentia impetuosity, from violentus violent]

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Wed, 03 Apr 2019 #94
Thumb_father-jack jamie f United Kingdom 10 posts in this forum Offline

Well, you got me bang to rights on at least two counts there.

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Wed, 03 Apr 2019 #95
Thumb_screenshot_20180710-010635 One Self United States 1053 posts in this forum Offline

"Our whole conscious concern is with the finding of a solution, a satisfying conclusion. Often we do find an answer that gratifies us, and then we think we have solved the problem. What we have actually done is to cover over the problem with a conclusion, with a satisfactory answer; but under the weight of the conclusion, which has temporarily smothered it, the problem is still there. The search for an answer is an evasion of the problem. When there is no satisfactory answer, the conscious or upper mind stops looking; and then the so-called unconscious, the deeper mind, takes over and finds an answer.".

Series I - Chapter 54 - 'The Conscious and the Unconscious'

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Wed, 03 Apr 2019 #96
Thumb_img_0244 Jack Pine United States 5492 posts in this forum Offline

One self, this is what you write to people who quote K. You wrote this to me last week on this thread and have written other similar idiotic notes to me several times.

So jack is the one who worships Krishnamurti. He uses k's phrase as absolute truth. What a robot he is.
So next time you get into an accident and become unconscious have the hospital read the above.:-)

I just thought I would point out, once again, what a truly miserable hypocrite you are. You've quoted K four or five times in the past couple of days. There is nothing wrong with quoting K. I don't care who quotes him. I just wanted you to see what a despicable hypocrite you really are.

You have single-handedly lowered the quality of this forum.

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Wed, 03 Apr 2019 #97
Thumb_img_0244 Jack Pine United States 5492 posts in this forum Offline

jamie f wrote:
It is probably best to avoid definitive statements, even if you're Krishnamurti.

Jamie, if you would simply take the time to read what I quoted from K he explains exactly what he meant about there being no "unconscious". I don't expect the moron on here to read it but you have the brains to understand what you are reading.

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Wed, 03 Apr 2019 #98
Thumb_screenshot_20180710-010635 One Self United States 1053 posts in this forum Offline

Mr False:
I don't expect the moron on here to read.

The right answer to an ignorant fool is silence.

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Wed, 03 Apr 2019 #99
Thumb_father-jack jamie f United Kingdom 10 posts in this forum Offline

Jack Pine wrote:
Jamie, if you would simply take the time to read what I quoted from K he explains exactly what he meant about there being no "unconscious".

Yes, I know. I did read it and it is pretty clear. I was having a little fun selecting quotations to make K contradict himself. It is fairly easy:


"the conscious or upper mind stops looking; and then the so-called unconscious, the deeper mind, takes over and finds an answer." Series I - Chapter 54 - 'The Conscious and the Unconscious'


"K: Therefore you are saying there is no unconscious.

S: Right.

K: You, the expert! You, who talk endlessly about the unconscious with your patients.

S: I don't.

K: You say there is no unconscious.

S: Right.

K: I agree with you. I say it is so."

THE WHOLENESS OF LIFE PART I DIALOGUE 6 6TH CONVERSATION WITH DR. DAVID SHAINBERG AND PROF. DAVID BOHM BROCKWOOD PARK 20TH MAY, 1976

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Thu, 04 Apr 2019 #100
Thumb_screenshot_20180710-010635 One Self United States 1053 posts in this forum Offline

jamie f wrote:
was having a little fun selecting quotations to make K contradict himself. It is fairly easy:

I don't see any contradiction in what k says in both cases.. The problem is Mr False trying to make a blue print from the teachings which is totally anti-k .

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Thu, 04 Apr 2019 #101
Thumb_img_0244 Jack Pine United States 5492 posts in this forum Offline

One Self wrote:
The right answer to an ignorant fool is silence.

Then why don't you take your own advice and shut up? You see what you are doing? You make up a childish little rule and then you don't follow it. Is it because you can't think of anything intelligent to say? No, that can't be it. You say stupid things all the time and that doesn't seem to bother you.

This post was last updated by Jack Pine Thu, 04 Apr 2019.

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Thu, 04 Apr 2019 #102
Thumb_img_0244 Jack Pine United States 5492 posts in this forum Offline

One Self wrote:
Mr False:
I don't expect the moron on here to read.

The right answer to an ignorant fool is silence.

I noticed when I referred to the "moron", without naming him or her, on this forum you immediately recognized yourself. Maybe you're not quite as stupid as I thought.

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Thu, 04 Apr 2019 #103
Thumb_profiel Wim Opdam Belgium 1330 posts in this forum Offline

One Self wrote:
I don't see any contradiction in what k says in both cases.

Usually people do not see what others see and that is
because you do not really look into your self!

Oops, where did that come from?

Have a quiet week, we are going to Brockwood.

Truth will unfold itself for those who enquire their own actions and only to them and for them and to or for no one else.

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Thu, 04 Apr 2019 #104
Thumb_screenshot_20180710-010635 One Self United States 1053 posts in this forum Offline

It is very odd that some people are sitting behind the computer and merely looking at what I say and then they respond to what I write like a second hand human being, if one can even call them that. For example if you read all of the 5000 posts that Mr False has in this forums 95% of them are like a dog barking at what a few other people wrote. He simply barks at what one writes without any meaning. The best way to deal with his noise is to ignore his next 1000 posts which are nothing new. He is like a tape player repeating itself and totally useless.

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Thu, 04 Apr 2019 #105
Thumb_img_0244 Jack Pine United States 5492 posts in this forum Offline

One Self wrote:
The best way to deal with his noise is to ignore his next 1000 posts which are nothing new.

OK then. Good. So you are going to take your own advice, that you have given to everyone else, and not read my next 1000 posts, right? You always follow your own advice, right? Or are you just full of crap as always? If you respond to this post we'll find out which person you are.

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Thu, 04 Apr 2019 #106
Thumb_img_0244 Jack Pine United States 5492 posts in this forum Offline

Wim Opdam wrote:
Have a quiet week, we are going to Brockwood.

And I am going to go up to Pine Cottage (what they call the library now) and talk to an old friend up there. Have a nice time in England Wim.

This post was last updated by Jack Pine Thu, 04 Apr 2019.

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Thu, 04 Apr 2019 #107
Thumb_screenshot_20180710-010635 One Self United States 1053 posts in this forum Offline

Stop quoting me Mr False ,you will never get it.
Anybody who quotes me will get his answer. Even the ignorant fools.

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Thu, 04 Apr 2019 #108
Thumb_screenshot_20180710-010635 One Self United States 1053 posts in this forum Offline

To quote someone in order to distort what he says is the action of an ignorant fool. Obviously it is a form of violence to distort .

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Thu, 04 Apr 2019 #109
Thumb_screenshot_20180710-010635 One Self United States 1053 posts in this forum Offline

Good, we will have a peace of mind in here till they come back to distort again .:-)

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Fri, 05 Apr 2019 #110
Thumb_img_0244 Jack Pine United States 5492 posts in this forum Offline

One self, your above posts, 108 through 110, show that you are not only full of crap, as I suspected you would be, but that you are also incoherent and irrational. What is it that you are trying to say with all that confused gibberish?

I knew you couldn't help yourself. You have to read my posts, you are compelled to read my posts. You are my most ardent follower. I have to say I really don't appreciate your servitude. I find it....undignified and obsequious.

This post was last updated by Jack Pine Fri, 05 Apr 2019.

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Fri, 05 Apr 2019 #111
Thumb_img_0244 Jack Pine United States 5492 posts in this forum Offline

Ken D wrote:
Think what a mess this forum would be if I had more than my 24 posts here.

Oh what the hell, Ken, let 'er rip. Express yourself as only you can do. I sort of enjoy your satire.

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Fri, 05 Apr 2019 #112
Thumb_screenshot_20180710-010635 One Self United States 1053 posts in this forum Offline

Ken D wrote:
Anything we are unaware of at a given moment is unconscious. There's your answer.

unconscious (?n?k?n??s)
adj
1. (Medicine) lacking normal sensory awareness of the environment; insensible
2. not aware of one's actions, behaviour, etc: unconscious of his bad manners.
3. characterized by lack of awareness or intention: an unconscious blunder.
4. (Psychoanalysis) coming from or produced by the unconscious: unconscious resentment.
n
(Psychoanalysis) psychoanal the part of the mind containing instincts, impulses, images, and ideas that are not available for direct examination. See also collective unconscious Compare subconscious, preconscious
un?consciously adv
Collins English Dictionary – Complete and Unabridged, 12th Edition 2014 © HarperCollins Publishers 1991, 1994, 1998, 2000, 2003, 2006, 2007, 2009, 2011, 2014

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Fri, 05 Apr 2019 #113
Thumb_screenshot_20180710-010635 One Self United States 1053 posts in this forum Offline

We don't need to define words for ourselves, that is why we have dictionaries. Our problems starts when we give our own meanings to the words that have already been established for thousands of years. As k says start with the meaning of the words and go beyond it. In other words don't get stuck in words for ever as apparently some of us are stuck .

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Sat, 06 Apr 2019 #114
Thumb_kr Ken D United States 34 posts in this forum Offline

One Self wrote:
Our problems starts when we give our own meanings to the words that have already been established for thousands of years.

But Krishnamurti uses words whose definitions have never been established with any precision, mainly because they aren't scientific to begin with. Terms like "essence", "virtue", "self", "being", "truth", "sacredness", "discipline",...the list is endless. Any given definition will vary from person to person. There is no consensus based, scientific definition for any of these terms, not even for words like "religion" or "reason", basically because they do not refer to anything material or capable of being measured. Nobody is going to mistake a giraffe for a gorilla, but with these other terms it's a crap shoot.

"It has occurred to me, brother, that wisdom may not be the end of everything. Goodness and kindliness are, perhaps, beyond wisdom." James Stephens

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Sat, 06 Apr 2019 #115
Thumb_screenshot_20180710-010635 One Self United States 1053 posts in this forum Offline

Ken D wrote:
But Krishnamurti uses words whose definitions have never been established with any precision, mainly because they aren't scientific to begin with.

Let's examine that statement. Is it true that krishnamurti used words whose definitions ....?

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Sat, 06 Apr 2019 #116
Thumb_screenshot_20180710-010635 One Self United States 1053 posts in this forum Offline

Ken D wrote:
But Krishnamurti uses words whose definitions have never been established with any precision, mainly because they aren't scientific to begin with.

Let's examine that statement. Is it true that krishnamurti used words whose definitions ....?

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Sat, 06 Apr 2019 #117
Thumb_screenshot_20180710-010635 One Self United States 1053 posts in this forum Offline

To me krishnamurti was a true scientist . He was never a guru of any kind.

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Sun, 07 Apr 2019 #118
Thumb_screenshot_20180710-010635 One Self United States 1053 posts in this forum Offline

What is important is not what k said or did, What is important to me is to have a clear mind. Not a mind that is caught in image- making. . Clear mind means not having a confused mind.

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Sun, 07 Apr 2019 #119
Thumb_kr Ken D United States 34 posts in this forum Offline

One Self wrote:
Clear mind means not having a confused mind.

"Mind" is another one of those fuzzy, baffling terms that can mean virtually anything one can imagine. Is the "mind" an after effect of the brain? Is it separate from the brain? What would it mean to be "separate" from the brain? There is no agreed upon answer to these puzzles.

"It has occurred to me, brother, that wisdom may not be the end of everything. Goodness and kindliness are, perhaps, beyond wisdom." James Stephens

This post was last updated by Ken D Sun, 07 Apr 2019.

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Sun, 07 Apr 2019 #120
Thumb_img_0244 Jack Pine United States 5492 posts in this forum Offline

One Self wrote:
To me krishnamurti was a true scientist . He was never a guru of any kind.

Do you notice how you seem to rush to label everything? These are conclusions based on thought which is incomplete. Why call K anything? You don't know what K was. You don't know who you are.

This post was last updated by Jack Pine Sun, 07 Apr 2019.

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