Krishnamurti & the Art of Awakening
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Why is this site so inactive?


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Mon, 02 Jul 2018 #1
Thumb_screenshot_2014-08-09-12-40-46 Goodman B United States 206 posts in this forum Offline

Hardly anybody is online.
Have we actually lost interest in the teachings?
Have we found refuge in the idea of the self and satisfied there?

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Mon, 02 Jul 2018 #2
Thumb_beautiful-nature-wallpaper pavani rao India 532 posts in this forum Offline

Hi Goodman

" Hardly anybody is online."

? Is it so ? On the contrary I feel people all over the world prefer to stay online. Every one glued to cell phones and other gadgets all the time ; isn't that a common site either in market places , malls or at air ports etc ?

"Have we actually lost interest in the teachings?"

May be its the other way round? Those who are actually interested in the teachings are the ones who are doing the 'silent work' ..... Either working on themselves or working with others .... I'm quite sure there must be thousands of people around the world who were affected by K teaching who might have heard him directly or by accidentally coming across the books one way or the other .

"Have we found refuge in the idea of the self and satisfied there?"

Didn't quite understand that question there .

This post was last updated by pavani rao Mon, 02 Jul 2018.

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Mon, 02 Jul 2018 #3
Thumb_me_3_reduced_copy Patricia Hemingway Australia 1867 posts in this forum Offline

pavani rao wrote:
May be its the other way round? Those who are actually interested in the teachings are the ones who are doing the 'silent work'

This is true. Hello Pavani.....

This post was last updated by Patricia Hemingway Mon, 02 Jul 2018.

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Tue, 03 Jul 2018 #4
Thumb_open-uri20171115-31086-13da1wu-0 Dan McDermott United States 1236 posts in this forum Offline

Patricia Hemingway wrote:
This is true.

I don't know, Patricia...the 'self' can be very devious. Pavani is saying that "those who are actually interested in the teachings are the ones who are doing the silent work". That's quite a damning statement to us 'non-silent ones', but one that you are agreeing with and saying is "true". We can see that ,those who do choose (dare) to speak with others here about what we have found, what we understand, what we have had insight into etc., we find what an enormous diversity of understanding there is about seemingly the most obvious things...so coming on here and saying something like, "if you truly understood K., you wouldn't be on here posting with others, you would be silent like 'I' am" etc., has an an elitist smell...personally, Pavani has called me "ignorant" for doing so , she may be right, I think that she is wrong, but she's welcome to her opinion. For me, posting now what is found, seen etc. is very important, it is my only opportunity to dialogue at this point with others interested, so for me it is of great value, and as one of the 'old timers' myself, I prefer taking the chance to have all my 'old timer' understanding swept out the door rather than cling to whatever I think I had found in all those past years...and that 'sweeping' can on occasion happen here, not so easy in one's "silent work" where one may easily be dreaming that one understands, because one believes oneself to be "ardent".

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Tue, 03 Jul 2018 #5
Thumb_me_3_reduced_copy Patricia Hemingway Australia 1867 posts in this forum Offline

Dan - I am really not at all interested in fatuous arguments. If you choose to feel 'damned' by what either Pavani or I wrote - go right ahead.

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Tue, 03 Jul 2018 #6
Thumb_stringio Huguette . Canada 451 posts in this forum Offline

Dan,

Is it really elitist to say that, “Everyone is glued to cell phones and other gadgets all the time; isn't that a common site either in marketplaces, malls or at airports etc?” Isn’t what Pavani has pointed out a true reflection of what we see all around us? --- mothers dragging their toddlers along while they engage in very important telephone conversations; pundits of every stripe pontificating over the airwaves; POTUS tweeting through the nights; talk shows; mindless blogs and cable TV; and so on and on.

I don’t see that Pavani said that NOT participating here IS a measure of insight!!?? Just as I don’t take YOU to mean that incessant talking IS a measure of an unmotivated interest to understand, or that we should we talk constantly just for the sake of talking!! I take it for granted that you feel as I do that understanding can’t be engendered by compulsive talking, by the need to constantly fill up the silence with words. First there must be silence, mustn’t there? And then out of silence we MIGHT find that we HAVE something spontaneous to say which comes from the wholeness of heart, intellect, and so on.

Sometimes we might WANT to say something but nothing comes spontaneously. Is there anything wrong with that? Should I force myself to come up with something when there is inner desolation?

This post was last updated by Huguette . Tue, 03 Jul 2018.

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Tue, 03 Jul 2018 #7
Thumb_profiel Wim Opdam Belgium 1078 posts in this forum Offline

pavani rao wrote:
I'm quite sure there must be thousands of people around the world who were affected by K teaching who might have heard him directly or by accidentally coming across the books one way or the other .

Hi Pavani,

Not only people affected by K teaching are working silently.
Lately I've heard several people expressing K.teaching stuff and they didn't know Krishnamurti at all.

One of them was a Vicar and if you transformed his using the word GOD in "unknown" it was as if K. Was describing/explaining something.

Truth will unfold itself for those who enquire their own actions and only to them and for them and to or for no one else.

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Tue, 03 Jul 2018 #8
Thumb_profiel Wim Opdam Belgium 1078 posts in this forum Offline

Huguette . wrote:
And then out of silence we MIGHT find that we HAVE something spontaneous to say which comes from the wholeness of heart, intellect, and so on.

And sometimes out of that silence one understand deeply that the only intelligent action is not spent any word on it.

Truth will unfold itself for those who enquire their own actions and only to them and for them and to or for no one else.

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Tue, 03 Jul 2018 #9
Thumb_profiel Wim Opdam Belgium 1078 posts in this forum Offline

Patricia Hemingway wrote:

pavani rao wrote:

May be its the other way round? Those who are actually interested in the teachings are the ones who are doing the 'silent work'

This is true. Hello Pavani.....

YES And is being "online" rather the restriction of freedom ;).

Truth will unfold itself for those who enquire their own actions and only to them and for them and to or for no one else.

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Tue, 03 Jul 2018 #10
Thumb_stringio Huguette . Canada 451 posts in this forum Offline

Huguette . wrote:
And then out of silence we MIGHT find that we HAVE something spontaneous to say which comes from the wholeness of heart, intellect, and so on.

Wim Opdam wrote:
And sometimes out of that silence one understand deeply that the only intelligent action is not spent any word on it.

Wim, maybe that's more or less what Pavani was trying to say, not attacking anyone. Sorry Pavani for talking "behind your back" in front of your face :o)

It seems to me that silence is natural when one is not seeing clearly into something one is looking into. Like you, I see such natural silence as the action of intelligence.

Clarity or lack of clarity, interest or lack of interest - don't necessarily mean that one will forever be silent OR endlessly talking!

Silence doesn't in itself indicate lack of interest, just as words don't signify interest. And if there IS a lack of interest, interest cannot be forced. Interest or no interest, clarity or confusion - words cannot be forced.

This post was last updated by Huguette . Tue, 03 Jul 2018.

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Tue, 03 Jul 2018 #11
Thumb_donna_and_jim_fb_bw Tom Paine United States 3098 posts in this forum Offline

Dan McDermott wrote:
it is my only opportunity to dialogue at this point with others interested, so for me it is of great value, and as one of the 'old timers' myself, I prefer taking the chance to have all my 'old timer' understanding swept out the door rather than cling to whatever I think I had found in all those past years...and that 'sweeping' can on occasion happen here, not so easy in one's "silent work" where one may easily be dreaming that one understands, because one believes oneself to be "ardent".

Indeed, Dan. Others overlooked what I feel is a good point....and why ‘silence’ is not always golden ;) It can be a stagnant pool too. Truth is often revealed in relationship....in our daily living....talking, acting, thinking, feeling... discussing, perhaps too.

Let it Be

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Tue, 03 Jul 2018 #12
Thumb_screenshot_2014-08-09-12-40-46 Goodman B United States 206 posts in this forum Offline

When I said that there is hardly anybody is online I meant online in this website.

As far as being silent or not silent is a question of intelligence and wisdom. Krishnamurti spoke from silence but he surely talked a lot. Intelligence is in listening not in talking or being silent .

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Tue, 03 Jul 2018 #13
Thumb_stringio Huguette . Canada 451 posts in this forum Offline

Goodman B wrote:
When I said that there is hardly anybody is online I meant online in this website.

Of course. It cannot be understood any other way. Nothing has been said that implies otherwise.

Goodman B wrote:
As far as being silent or not silent is a question of intelligence and wisdom. Krishnamurti spoke from silence but he surely talked a lot. Intelligence is in listening not in talking or being silent .

Intelligence can be in listening, in talking and in being silent - or not. There is no intelligence in listening with a noisy mind or in talking out of knowledge. Nor is there intelligence in forced silence or in the superficial appearance of silence.

Of course this is said with regard to understanding oneself, not in the context of technical, scientific or social exchanges. It is understood that there is a proper place for knowledge.

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Tue, 03 Jul 2018 #14
Thumb_k2 Ken D United States 56 posts in this forum Offline

Huguette . wrote:
Is it really elitist to say that, “Everyone is glued to cell phones and other gadgets all the time; isn't that a common site either in marketplaces, malls or at airports etc?” Isn’t what Pavani has pointed out a true reflection of what we see all around us?

Well, of course, none of us would be here posting anything without the existence of computers and the internet. We've all been ensnared by this technology. Basically, we now live in a virtual world. The politicians create their own reality, change it every few minutes, and because there is nothing in the real world to challenge it, the virtual is accepted for the truth. We are actually turning ourselves into little more than data processing machines.

"What emptiness do you gaze upon! Do you not feel a thrill passing through the air with the notes of the far-away song floating from the other shore?" Rabindranath Tagore

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Tue, 03 Jul 2018 #15
Thumb_screenshot_2014-08-09-12-40-46 Goodman B United States 206 posts in this forum Offline

pavani rao wrote:
Hi Goodman

" Hardly anybody is online."

? Is it so ? On the contrary I feel people all over the world prefer to stay online. Every one glued to cell phones and other gadgets all the time ;

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Tue, 03 Jul 2018 #16
Thumb_screenshot_2014-08-09-12-40-46 Goodman B United States 206 posts in this forum Offline

Huguette . wrote:
Of course. It cannot be understood any other way. Nothing has been said that implies otherwise.

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Tue, 03 Jul 2018 #17
Thumb_screenshot_2014-08-09-12-40-46 Goodman B United States 206 posts in this forum Offline

I think we don't read carefully what is being said.

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Tue, 03 Jul 2018 #18
Thumb_stringio Huguette . Canada 451 posts in this forum Offline

B,

Yes, sorry for being careless about this point. What about the rest of what I’m saying? Do you have any thoughts about that?

This post was last updated by Huguette . Tue, 03 Jul 2018.

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Tue, 03 Jul 2018 #19
Thumb_screenshot_2014-08-09-12-40-46 Goodman B United States 206 posts in this forum Offline

H, I say one thing and your mind immediately negates that and says intelligence is not about listening. Why does the mind do that? Did you experiment with what was said or you just use your memory to respond. Life is about experimentation but we don't experiment because we want to be safe. And words give us comfort and assurances. It is hard to explain what is going on in our mind and why it does what it does.

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Tue, 03 Jul 2018 #20
Thumb_stringio Huguette . Canada 451 posts in this forum Offline

Goodman B wrote:
your mind immediately negates that and says intelligence is not about listening

No, I didn't say that.

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Tue, 03 Jul 2018 #21
Thumb_beautiful-nature-wallpaper pavani rao India 532 posts in this forum Offline

Patricia Hemingway wrote:
Hello Pavani.....

Hello Patricia
How have you been ? Good to hear from you :)

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Tue, 03 Jul 2018 #22
Thumb_beautiful-nature-wallpaper pavani rao India 532 posts in this forum Offline

Hi every one

Dan, Huguette and wim , sorry couldn't come back to the thread as I was kind of busy with grand kids and all that :)
Well if I can address few points all together in one post ... Sorry Dan if at any point of our interactions if I ever made a remark of ' ignorant ' at you ( as far as my knowledge goes I don't remember ever saying so blatant a remark like that to you ) in fact I enjoy reading most of your posts when time permits as they come out with understanding, insight and clarity and so are the posts of Huguette . and Dan I do agree with the entire content of your post which sounds rather fiery ! :) for people like you who are quite good in expressive abilities, writing regularly , expressing vividly may be a good form of exploration with others . But for me it's the other way round . being silent and rather a kind of introverted person from my childhood ... for me the answers occur in mostly my day to day interactions with people around me and in spending time with nature . and of course enormous material of K texts keeps one aboard , not getting lost in illusions and provides a good check where one is ... and as Good man made a very valid point, I would like to conclude this post with that remark .

Goodman B wrote:
As far as being silent or not silent is a question of intelligence and wisdom. Krishnamurti spoke from silence but he surely talked a lot. Intelligence is in listening not in talking or being silent .

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Wed, 04 Jul 2018 #23
Thumb_profiel Wim Opdam Belgium 1078 posts in this forum Offline

Huguette . wrote:
Wim, maybe that's more or less what Pavani was trying to say, not attacking anyone

That's could be one of the consequences,
but what was meant by 'deep understanding'
that any other action then 'silence' at that instance
would create more misunderstanding !

Truth will unfold itself for those who enquire their own actions and only to them and for them and to or for no one else.

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Wed, 04 Jul 2018 #24
Thumb_profiel Wim Opdam Belgium 1078 posts in this forum Offline

pavani rao wrote:
... for me the answers occur in mostly my day to day interactions with people around me and in spending time with nature . and of course enormous material of K texts keeps one aboard , not getting lost in illusions and provides a good check where one is

pavani,
as if you took the words out of my mind, so beautiful and simple said.

Truth will unfold itself for those who enquire their own actions and only to them and for them and to or for no one else.

This post was last updated by Wim Opdam Wed, 04 Jul 2018.

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Fri, 06 Jul 2018 #25
Thumb_screenshot_2014-08-09-12-40-46 Goodman B United States 206 posts in this forum Offline

Huguette . wrote:
There is no intelligence in listening with a noisy mind or in talking out of knowledge

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Fri, 06 Jul 2018 #26
Thumb_screenshot_2014-08-09-12-40-46 Goodman B United States 206 posts in this forum Offline

Listening with a noise is better than not listening at all. Don't you think?

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Fri, 06 Jul 2018 #27
Thumb_donna_and_jim_fb_bw Tom Paine United States 3098 posts in this forum Offline

Goodman B wrote:
Listening with a noise is better than not listening at all

No, because you're only hearing through the screen of conditioning. It's not really listening at all. That type of listening is the cause of all interpersonal conflict, as far as I can tell.

Let it Be

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Sat, 07 Jul 2018 #28
Thumb_screenshot_2014-08-09-12-40-46 Goodman B United States 206 posts in this forum Offline

If you don't listen to your own conditioning and anxiety no one will.

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Sat, 07 Jul 2018 #29
Thumb_donna_and_jim_fb_bw Tom Paine United States 3098 posts in this forum Offline

Goodman B wrote:
If you don't listen to your own conditioning and anxiety no one will.

How do you listen to your anxiety? With a noisy mind? That’s not really listening if your mind is chattering away looking to overcome the anxiety or find solutions to your problem in thought. It’s just more thinking....not listening, isn’t it?

Let it Be

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Sat, 07 Jul 2018 #30
Thumb_screenshot_2014-08-09-12-40-46 Goodman B United States 206 posts in this forum Offline

Start by listening to the noise outside, the cars ,the wind , the sound of the fan .Then listen to your own mind ,the anxiety,the loneliness, the uncertainty and so on. Do it and find out . Don't start thinking by the word "If". Do it and find out.

This post was last updated by Goodman B Sat, 07 Jul 2018.

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