Krishnamurti & the Art of Awakening
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Just a word of thanks...


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Sat, 12 Aug 2017 #91
Thumb_donna_and_jim_fb_bw Tom Paine United States 3032 posts in this forum Offline

dave h wrote:
How do you deal with psychopaths/narcissists in your life?

That one's easy. Stay as far away as possible. Talking with them is useless....psychopaths that is. If they're running for president, don't vote for them! Or support their opponent with your money and time. I don't see any other way.

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Sat, 12 Aug 2017 #92
Thumb_stringio Huguette . Canada 398 posts in this forum Offline

dave h wrote:
Well, how will you decide to achieve inner order (or anything) from a state of disorder? How do you deal with psychopaths/narcissists in your life? How do you deal with disease/illness?

I can't decide to achieve inner order. I am seeing my own disorder, that's all I can do, isn't it? Out of seeing my own disorder, there comes some degree of order in my own thinking and action, as I see it... but maybe not.

As for dealing with psychopaths, I think what Tom says (#91) makes sense, unless it's someone close to you, a son, daughter, a friend, a parent - then to be as rational, as non-judgmental, as realistic as possible - meaning to be fully attentive - do the best according to one's understanding. How do you deal with it?

Added:

And as Jack says, if it's a public figure, speak out to the best of one's understanding, not losing sight of one's own limitations.

This post was last updated by Huguette . Sat, 12 Aug 2017.

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Sat, 12 Aug 2017 #93
Thumb_profiel Wim Opdam Belgium 1030 posts in this forum Offline

Huguette . wrote:
And as Jack says, if it's a public figure, speak out to the best of one's understanding, not losing sight of one's own limitations.

is it much too much to asked for humanity that leaders of states are tested
for psychological stability and health ??

Truth will unfold itself for those who enquire their own actions and only to them and for them and to or for no one else.

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Sat, 12 Aug 2017 #94
Thumb_stringio Huguette . Canada 398 posts in this forum Offline

Wim Opdam wrote:
is it much too much to asked for humanity that leaders of states are tested
for psychological stability and health ??

But who will test them, Wim? Dr. Frankenstein, the other politicians, religious leaders.... who?

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Sat, 12 Aug 2017 #95
Thumb_donna_and_jim_fb_bw Tom Paine United States 3032 posts in this forum Offline

Huguette . wrote:
Wim Opdam wrote:

is it much too much to asked for humanity that leaders of states are tested
for psychological stability and health ??
But who will test them, Wim? Dr. Frankenstein, the other politicians, religious leaders.... who?

And Trump's supporters would accept the verdict of the mental health experts? Like they accept the evidence of the scientists on climate change? Irony intended ;)

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Sun, 13 Aug 2017 #96
Thumb_baboon-9186 dave h United Kingdom 1153 posts in this forum Offline

Huguette . wrote:
I can't decide to achieve inner order. I am seeing my own disorder, that's all I can do, isn't it? Out of seeing my own disorder, there comes some degree of order in my own thinking and action, as I see it... but maybe not.

Well, just because someone's brain is not wired up to experience empathy, doesn't necessarily mean there is no order to their thinking. But there's more to it than just a lack of empathy.

Also what does disorder mean anyway? Is there an objective definition? The word means something out sequence, something out of place, right? Or is it always subjective? When a doctor sees a cancer, he sees disorder right? And he studies it, and gives treatment, and maybe if the patient is lucky there is relatively less disorder.

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Sun, 13 Aug 2017 #97
Thumb_baboon-9186 dave h United Kingdom 1153 posts in this forum Offline

Huguette . wrote:
As for dealing with psychopaths, I think what Tom says (#91) makes sense, unless it's someone close to you, a son, daughter, a friend, a parent - then to be as rational, as non-judgmental, as realistic as possible - meaning to be fully attentive - do the best according to one's understanding. How do you deal with it?

I try to keep my distance also, as I have learnt, from experience, that there is no way to give someone else empathy or sensitivity or compassion. A psychopath will take and take from an empath, until there is nothing left to take, or the psychopath gets bored and finds another target. The psychopath has a massive advantage other the empath, in being able to achieve his/her goals: he/she does not care, and will go to shocking lengths, to psychologically manipulate and attack. The empath, will always lose in this "game" of goals and power. What an empath, can do that a psychopath cannot, is form relatively healthy relationships with other empaths.

This post was last updated by dave h Sun, 13 Aug 2017.

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Sun, 13 Aug 2017 #98
Thumb_stringio Huguette . Canada 398 posts in this forum Offline

96:

dave h wrote:
Well, just because someone's brain is not wired up to experience empathy, doesn't necessarily mean there is no order to their thinking. But there's more to it than just a lack of empathy.

Also what does disorder mean anyway? Is there an objective definition? The word means something out sequence, something out of place, right? Or is it always subjective? When a doctor sees a cancer, he sees disorder right? And he studies it, and gives treatment, and maybe if the patient is lucky there is relatively less disorder.

I agree, there is order in disorder as well. If there were no order in disease, for example, no treatment could be found, could it? In spite of black holes and other such things which I don’t understand, if there were no order in space and the universe, there could be no life at all, it seems to me. The planets would long ago have smashed into each other.

But here we are talking about psychological disorder creating disorder in relationship on every level. This is not a definition but something that each one of us either experiences, perceives … or not. Isn’t it? If someone feels or perceives his life to be in disorder, then he is interested in order, which means understanding his own disorder. No?

This post was last updated by Huguette . Sun, 13 Aug 2017.

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Mon, 14 Aug 2017 #99
Thumb_profiel Wim Opdam Belgium 1030 posts in this forum Offline

Huguette . wrote:

Wim Opdam wrote:

is it much too much to asked for humanity that leaders of states are tested
for psychological stability and health ??

But who will test them, Wim? Dr. Frankenstein, the other politicians, religious leaders.... who?

Yes, it would be of some arrogance if I would give up myself as a volunteer ;-)

But why do we send a criminal on the basis of a jury to prison or worse to a death penalty ??

Tom Paine wrote:
And Trump's supporters would accept the verdict of the mental health experts? Like they accept the evidence of the scientists on climate change? Irony intended ;)

If it's done by the nomination he did not had followers than, he had not gathered his troops !! He is made great by the media through his outraging behaviour isn't he ??

Wim Opdam wrote:
is it much too much to asked for humanity that leaders of states are tested
for psychological stability and health ??

it is clear to me that if there is a solution at all it must come from a psychological and healthy humanity, which is not in need of leaders or at least such persons did not have a chance to be elected.

Truth will unfold itself for those who enquire their own actions and only to them and for them and to or for no one else.

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Mon, 14 Aug 2017 #100
Thumb_donna_and_jim_fb_bw Tom Paine United States 3032 posts in this forum Offline

Wim Opdam wrote:
If it's done by the nomination he did not had followers than, he had not gathered his troops !!

Perhaps it should be a requirement for running for president in the first place. They (who?) test you before you're even allowed to be a candidate. It's not clear how the standard for sanity would be determined, however. Is Clinton sane? Or Bush, who lied our way into a war that cost hundreds of thousands of lives?

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