Krishnamurti & the Art of Awakening
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Who Are You?


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Sun, 07 Apr 2013 #1
Thumb_stringio Arthur Landon United States 146 posts in this forum ACCOUNT DELETED

At least one person in this forum holds the belief that "you are not the body". I wonder how many others are of this persuasion. I wonder also why one chooses to believe such a fanciful notion. From what observation, experimentation, and all the evidence shows, you most certainly are the body, and your sense of who you are (along with everything else) is generated by brain activity.

You, I, we, are nothing more than living, breathing organisms in complex relationship with other organisms and natural processes. That we can reflect on this and think about it makes it even more interesting, but it also allows for the ability to dream up all sorts of wacky notions about who and what we are.

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Sun, 07 Apr 2013 #2
Thumb_stringio G M Norway 81 posts in this forum ACCOUNT DELETED

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ydAfgSIgU_E

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Sun, 07 Apr 2013 #3
Thumb_stringio Arthur Landon United States 146 posts in this forum ACCOUNT DELETED

Katy A wrote:
(The other person is me)

What do you mean, Katy? Are you saying that you, too, believe you are not merely the organism known as Katy; that there is more to your identity than brain activity?

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Sun, 07 Apr 2013 #4
Thumb_img_7089_copy Eve G. Indonesia 1570 posts in this forum Offline

Katy A wrote:
I think I must be drinking too much coffee ! Sorry, for going all around the houses. A good question to ask. Thanks, Katy

Why do we do this? Why not observe here and now what we are and not worry about if there is existence elsewhere? What is it that drives us to speculate about the soul?

If I am here and this is a painful/pleasurable place to be, why does one bother with anything else?

Do you see the connection between getting lost in words, thoughts and confusion?

There is the body and the confused mind that escapes its own creation....confusion/sorrow;) and then there is also death. Thank God the organism ends. The rest is only speculation, conjecture, words, images and there we exist and loose ourselves.

The nature of the change from disorder is silence.

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Sun, 07 Apr 2013 #5
Thumb_dsci0664 George Lanroh United States 200 posts in this forum Offline

Katy A wrote:
It is my brain which directs my person and I, Katy, will cease to be or knowing (intellectually) that I was ever here at all when my brain dies.

Katy, in a sense we were never really here ever. In a sense it is faith that is required to continue to believe we are a separate existence from the whole. If being a catholic at one time can be negated and a new identity can be assumed in order to maintain orbit outside the whole :) Then maybe, just maybe the identification with a separate self is nothing more then your self in a dream which states she is going to be there upon waking up :) I hope you don't mind my intrusion I was just enjoying all that you were pointing to.

There is no other.

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Mon, 08 Apr 2013 #6
Thumb_stringio Arthur Landon United States 146 posts in this forum ACCOUNT DELETED

Katy A wrote:
It is my brain which directs my person and I, Katy, will cease to be or knowing (intellectually) that I was ever here at all when my brain dies.

Thanks for sharing this, Katy, but you realize that this isn't what K was teaching. There are probably more people in this forum smitten with the notion that they are eternal in some non-personal way than there are those who know that consciousness is nothing but brain activity.

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Mon, 08 Apr 2013 #7
Thumb_2564 Satya Prakash India 528 posts in this forum Offline

Katy A wrote:
A welcome and interesting reply, not an 'intrusion' at all, Eve...

George

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Mon, 08 Apr 2013 #8
Thumb_2564 Satya Prakash India 528 posts in this forum Offline

George Lanroh wrote:
In a sense it is faith that is required to continue to believe we are a separate existence from the whole.

Nice to read your reply in a different forum, George.

It is more a question of ignorance rather than faith. First one sees that 'why' one is separate from whole and then, may be, he sees the unity with the whole. When faith is in operation, then necessity to see is already badly compromised, isn't it?

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Mon, 08 Apr 2013 #9
Thumb_img_7089_copy Eve G. Indonesia 1570 posts in this forum Offline

Katy A wrote:
Now for some basket- making...:)

My speculation about death.... death is like taking ski boots off after a long day at the slopes......;)

The nature of the change from disorder is silence.

This post was last updated by Eve G. Mon, 08 Apr 2013.

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Mon, 08 Apr 2013 #10
Thumb_man_question_mark dhirendra singh India 2984 posts in this forum Offline

Presently death is ending of person, possibly in future scientist will be able to copy person with complete memory and transfer into his cloned brain, then possibly person can continue, otherwise person ends with death.

Reincarnation and soul are concepts, I don't know why we need soul, when sperm and ovum, both are alive, and after fertilization they are able to develop according to their genetic codes, there is neither any need of soul to enter into them and nor they can hold something transparent non material like 'soul' into them, they are not right pot for it.

I don't know

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Mon, 08 Apr 2013 #11
Thumb_man_question_mark dhirendra singh India 2984 posts in this forum Offline

Katy A wrote:
Sleep is like a temporary death

Hi katy, this is also a belief preached by gurus, death is totally different than sleep, there is no comparison between two, sleep is part of living being, in death there is end of life.

I don't know

This post was last updated by dhirendra singh Mon, 08 Apr 2013.

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Mon, 08 Apr 2013 #12
Thumb_img_7089_copy Eve G. Indonesia 1570 posts in this forum Offline

Katy A wrote:
What about people who say they want to 'die with their boots on' ? (as in the expression). I suppose there is always the exception...:)

Cowboy boots....yes not ski boots. No one in her right mind would want to die with ski boots, unless they were caught in an avalanche of buffalo bagels? stay here long enough, and you will meet your demise and will not need to speculate anymore. Please report what is going on the other side. Yes boots or no bootzzz.

The nature of the change from disorder is silence.

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Mon, 08 Apr 2013 #13
Thumb_img_7089_copy Eve G. Indonesia 1570 posts in this forum Offline

dhirendra singh wrote:
Hi katy, this is also a belief preached by gurus, death is totally different then sleep, there is no comparison between two, sleep is part of living being, in death there is end of life.

NO way Dhi,

According to science energy can not be created or destroyed....we are energy we can only change form. This is a scientific fact. You may become fertilizer but you will never end.... ;) But we can make a great basket of flowers....

"Energy Cannot Naturally Be Created or Destroyed
One of most basic laws of science is the Law of the Conservation of Energy. Energy cannot be created or destroyed; it can only be changed from one form to another.

Energy is not currently being created. The universe could not have created itself using natural processes because nature did not exist before the universe came into existence. Something beyond nature must have created all the energy and matter that is observed today. Present measures of energy are immeasurably enormous, indicating a power source so great that "infinite" is the best word we have to describe it.

The logical conclusion is that our supernatural Creator with infinite power created the universe. There is no energy source capable to originate what we observe today."

The nature of the change from disorder is silence.

This post was last updated by Eve G. Mon, 08 Apr 2013.

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Mon, 08 Apr 2013 #14
Thumb_man_question_mark dhirendra singh India 2984 posts in this forum Offline

Eve G. wrote:
According to science energy can not be created or destroyed....we are energy we can only change form. This is a scientific fact. You may become fertilizer but you will never end.... ;)

Eve G. wrote:
The logical conclusion is that our supernatural Creator with infinite power created the universe. There is no energy source capable to originate what we observe today.

:) All I mean that after death, energy as a 'person x' change in such way into an other form which never returns back in form of that person 'x', unless scientist, in future, discover to copy and pate it;)
Person ends, but let the energy stay forever, that energy is not my grandpaa, he is dead.

I don't know

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Mon, 08 Apr 2013 #15
Thumb_dsci0664 George Lanroh United States 200 posts in this forum Offline

dhirendra singh wrote:
:) All I mean that after death, energy as a 'person x' change in such way into an other form which never returns back in form of that person 'x', unless scientist, in future, discover to copy and pate it;)
Person ends, but let the energy stay forever, that energy is not my grandpaa, he is dead.

Yes Grandpa ends, yet Grandpa can also end in what we call this life time if and when the restrictions of accumulations are transcended. This applies to ourselves as seen here as to the accumulations which fixate us.

There is no other.

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Mon, 08 Apr 2013 #16
Thumb_dsci0664 George Lanroh United States 200 posts in this forum Offline

Katy A wrote:
Thanks, George, for this observation which lets me see/know the 'farcicle' or false elements. I did wake up this morning so I believe that I am still here:)

This is a touchy subject. Were you still here or was it your accumulated image of yourself here? :) Im only saying upon physical death or when the body is still walking about, the image of ourselves which can limit consciousness can end or simply be used for convenience, a tool, a marker, an address for that which can step out of accumulation and go beyond. And address (he he) a P.O box for that which has no home. As seen here.

There is no other.

This post was last updated by George Lanroh Mon, 08 Apr 2013.

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Mon, 08 Apr 2013 #17
Thumb_dsci0664 George Lanroh United States 200 posts in this forum Offline

Satya Prakash wrote:
When faith is in operation, then necessity to see is already badly compromised, isn't it?

Yes faith is an obstacle to the limitless.

Satya Prakash wrote:
Nice to read your reply in a different forum, George.

Its nice to come out of the dungeon once in awhile.

There is no other.

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Mon, 08 Apr 2013 #18
Thumb_beautiful-nature-wallpaper pavani rao India 541 posts in this forum Offline

George Lanroh wrote:
Its nice to come out of the dungeon once in awhile.

Hi George 

I completely agree with Sathya's post 12 ,  Good to see you moving out from your much defined space which of late is becoming quite busy due to intervention of lot of other people .... and to participate in other forums that too one started by Arthur is a welcome sign if one can say . And in a way I would suggest do it more often ( provided you don't mind heeding my suggestion ) :)

Well to be able to see the merit in others and  be open to learning is really worth appreciable . 

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Mon, 08 Apr 2013 #19
Thumb_stringio Arthur Landon United States 146 posts in this forum ACCOUNT DELETED

Eve G. wrote:
You may become fertilizer but you will never end....

But you will cease to be you, the consciousness you are at this time. You will come to a total and complete end; you will cease to exist.

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Mon, 08 Apr 2013 #20
Thumb_stringio Arthur Landon United States 146 posts in this forum ACCOUNT DELETED

Eve G. wrote:
The logical conclusion is that our supernatural Creator with infinite power created the universe. There is no energy source capable to originate what we observe today.

Eve, you must tell us more about "our supernatural Creator". K-advocates usually cringe at the notion, but in this forum, anything goes.

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Mon, 08 Apr 2013 #21
Thumb_stringio Arthur Landon United States 146 posts in this forum ACCOUNT DELETED

George Lanroh wrote:
Yes Grandpa ends, yet Grandpa can also end in what we call this life time if and when the restrictions of accumulations are transcended.

George, please stop making statements like this without elaborating or explaining. What the devil are you talking about? Who is transcending what? What is being "transcended"?

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Mon, 08 Apr 2013 #22
Thumb_stringio Arthur Landon United States 146 posts in this forum ACCOUNT DELETED

George Lanroh wrote:
Im only saying upon physical death or when the body is still walking about, the image of ourselves which can limit consciousness can end or simply be used for convenience, a tool, a marker, an address for that which can step out of accumulation and go beyond.

Stark raving lunacy.

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Mon, 08 Apr 2013 #23
Thumb_stringio Arthur Landon United States 146 posts in this forum ACCOUNT DELETED

George Lanroh wrote:
Yes faith is an obstacle to the limitless.

"The limitless" is a fanciful notion of the limited.

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Mon, 08 Apr 2013 #24
Thumb_dsci0664 George Lanroh United States 200 posts in this forum Offline

Arthur Landon wrote:
"The limitless" is a fanciful notion of the limited.

An antidote.

There is no other.

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Mon, 08 Apr 2013 #25
Thumb_dsci0664 George Lanroh United States 200 posts in this forum Offline

Arthur Landon wrote:
George, please stop making statements like this without elaborating or explaining. What the devil are you talking about? Who is transcending what? What is being "transcended"?

Yes, from the first not a thing is. Then why ask for explanations :)

There is no other.

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Mon, 08 Apr 2013 #26
Thumb_stringio Arthur Landon United States 146 posts in this forum ACCOUNT DELETED

George Lanroh wrote:
Yes, from the first not a thing is. Then why ask for explanations :)

Keep talking in riddles, George...they love it.

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Mon, 08 Apr 2013 #27
Thumb_img_7089_copy Eve G. Indonesia 1570 posts in this forum Offline

dhirendra singh wrote:
:) All I mean that after death, energy as a 'person x' change in such way into an other form which never returns back in form of that person 'x', unless scientist, in future, discover to copy and pate it;)
Person ends, but let the energy stay forever, that energy is not my grandpaa, he is dead.

Whats in a name and identity :) it is all just manure no? Energy is what counts. Energy is me you and your grandpa in a universal celebration of life. Now how great it is:)

The nature of the change from disorder is silence.

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Mon, 08 Apr 2013 #28
Thumb_img_7089_copy Eve G. Indonesia 1570 posts in this forum Offline

Arthur Landon wrote:
Stark raving lunacy.

See George? Here comes lunacy, a disturbed image in search of relief from itself.

The nature of the change from disorder is silence.

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Mon, 08 Apr 2013 #29
Thumb_img_7089_copy Eve G. Indonesia 1570 posts in this forum Offline

Arthur Landon wrote:
Eve, you must tell us more about "our supernatural Creator". K-advocates usually cringe at the notion, but in this forum, anything goes.

Follow the thread carefully. This is not coming from here. It is a technical problem just like you ;)

The nature of the change from disorder is silence.

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Mon, 08 Apr 2013 #30
Thumb_stringio Arthur Landon United States 146 posts in this forum ACCOUNT DELETED

We're still waiting to hear all about "our supernatural Creator", eve. It isn't nice to mention such a grandiose notion without any explanation.

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