Krishnamurti & the Art of Awakening
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Joe Loveys' Forum Posts

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Displaying posts 1 - 30 of 280 in total
Topic: Delirium Tremens and such Mon, 29 Aug 2016

Thanks for the replies above. I've been into the K. stuff off and on for a long time. Sometimes he's like an old buddy or a walk in the woods. So often we get caught up in trivial stuff and forget how unimportant many things are. A dude like K. can help sort that out pretty fast. I guess we spend most of our time living on an agitated, restless surface. So many of our concerns are really just all about our own fears and so on. As people know around here, the guy was immense. So there's no end to what he spoke of.

Personally, I'm up and down with the mood swings and such. The sleep has been sparse even with 5 mg of melatonin. The physical health is good, the coughing has mostly stopped, the urge to drink is largely absent. The appetite is big. The primary concern is cognitive issues. Memory is a bit off. Agitation occurs frequently. I'm writing a lot of stuff down. Communication still seems hard. Confusion was/is at the center of all this. I'm also just bored with my small hometown and all the familiarity of everything. I used to live in big cities over in east Asia teaching English for many years. That was stressful too a lot of the time, but there's something about being in a foreign place and not understanding the language around you.

Health care professionals have suggested a sort of rehab for about a month in another town in my province here in Canada. I'd have to give notice at work and leave the support system here for a while, but I imagine that rehab retreat or whatever it is might be a good plan yet. What's a month anyway when we're talking about a lifetime?

Topic: Delirium Tremens and such Fri, 26 Aug 2016

Hello all. Some will remember me around here. I haven't posted in ages. I recently went through a major event. I had a stay in the hospital due to drinking. The DTs as they call them. The confusion was intense and still lingers, and the symptoms or effects can last a long time, like a year perhaps. I haven't had alcohol in about 2 weeks but even this morning for a while I felt drunk.

I am a bartender. I also quit smoking at the same time. It's not so easy to change behaviors quickly, ones you've been at for years. Esp. Hanging out in the same environment around the same people, trying to be Joe 2.0 all of a sudden. But like I said the event changed me as I felt I was near death's door.

I'm getting some counseling and such. I don't think the addictions are as big a deal as the mental state, this has left me with loads of confusion regarding people, how they communicate, and so much more. It's hard to find people willing to listen to these things outside of professionals. I've got a few friends though and a good brother or two. One suffered from worse alcohol problems than this with the "wet brain" and another is currently also trying to get help with drinking problems.

Any responses about any of this is welcome.

Topic: Is anybody simple, or how complicated are we? Fri, 18 Dec 2015

An old "Commentaries on Living" piece was called "To Be Intelligent Is To Be Simple." I was talking with a woman I like talking to at the bar the other night. I'm not sure what led her to asking me, "Why do you have to make things difficult?" And another thing she said was "Things can be as simple as you want them to be." I dunno how true either of those things are. Seems to me a lot of people act simple and speak using mostly simple words, but does that make them uncomplicated inside? I guess most readers here know what I'm getting at. We are obviously a very complicated lot, or why else are so many of us a mess, and the world one as well? Not sure I know anybody I'd describe as simple, in the good meaning of that word, whose life is uncluttered by all the troubles most people go through.

Topic: Depression Thu, 16 Jul 2015

I'm not really depressed, or perhaps in a low level form. Maybe this is a normal response to getting older, or seeing how awful life can be. Have you become a little more philosophical with age? I'm 45, not old really. But who knows what the coming years will bring.

I think perhaps at this age I have a pretty good perspective on what people are into. Most of them are fine, but what many have done is unreal. I dunno if I'm scared to die. Perhaps suffering sounds worse or bringing unhappiness to my family.

I'm interested in your deep thoughts on all this, how the thinker divides himself from his thought and all that stuff you guys understand.

Topic: God intoxicated. Mon, 22 Jun 2015

One of the harder things to understand according to Special K. is that the crisis is in ourselves. I savored the phrase "a crisis of consciousness" for a while. Surely this is also hard to accept for most people, where there are endless battles with issues they name a thing outside themselves. The resolution, according to the usual way, is to fight these endless battles, and not to deal with thinking. The battles remain, and the thinking too that the many crises are outside me.

Topic: God intoxicated. Sun, 21 Jun 2015

George Lanroh wrote: What have you found out or seen Joe?

Maybe that keeps changing. I found that the old brain is pretty dull most of the time. It's getting older and more tired. It may be wearing itself away with the same troubles it has had for years.

I found there is comfort in habit and routine.

I found most people are utterly restless. For this reason we look at things very superficially and think we have answers to problems.

Topic: God intoxicated. Sat, 20 Jun 2015

That quote surely describes a state many people long for. Some people have talked of experiencing something like that, and then never being the same again. Some of them got rich after telling others all about this wonderful experience. Most people have a confusing and tiresome life I suppose, and wouldn't it be great to have such peace? But then you know as well as I do that people are restless in themselves, always preoccupied with something.

Topic: Opinions Thu, 11 Jun 2015

This topic is surely over my head but I'll take a shot at it. We all opinions about all sorts of things. Sometimes I think opinions are just a kind of self importance. We all like what we like and dislike what we don't like obviously, but sometimes you get a sense that there is defensiveness about all this. Like people get upset with each other because they don't agree on something, even a small thing like which music you like.

Topic: "Give me your undivided attention." Tue, 19 May 2015

One thing K. was sad about, or at least I suppose you could say he was sad about, was people going off to foreign lands in search of truth. To him that was ridiculous. I think we all wish we had a better understanding of life and people and many other things. But you know the famous maxim as well, "Begin near to go far." It's so rare to ever go far, at least for me. I'm OK with that. Some people go nuts with this pursuit, and they think through shaving their heads or wearing certain clothes, or whatever trend they follow, that will help. None of that means much, other than the desire to appear spiritual I guess.

Topic: "Give me your undivided attention." Sun, 17 May 2015

I have no idea what truth is, but since we're on a Krishnamurti site, I can paraphrase something he said in one of his many amazing talks.

"Truth is not something elusive, out there, to be found. Rather, truth is where you are."

Topic: "Give me your undivided attention." Sat, 16 May 2015

Jack Pine wrote: Joe it's a pretty common expression as I'm sure you know.

Sure, but like a lot of language it's kind of sloppy in that it's asking for something that most people rarely have. Sometimes when you pay attention to other people you see how distracted they are too. You might wonder if we're living in times of greater distraction and decreasing attention spans. Seems to me most people are all over the place most of the time. Indeed life demands a lot from us, but we just seem to be too scatterbrained to deal with it effectively.

Topic: "Give me your undivided attention." Wed, 13 May 2015

This was something my old high school principal would say. Now I wonder what it means. Rarely is my attention undivided, and I guess that's true for most people. It seems to always be in several places at the same time.

Topic: Suffering Tue, 05 May 2015

I think most people live with a great deal of sorrow or suffering. So much so, that maybe it is largely buried to get on with the business of living. We are an accumulative lot, and so we collect sorrows in the way a library collects books, ever increasing its inventory. Through these pains, which are recent or old, we carry on. Then we are deeply blinded because we live in the personal bias of hurt. We see things according to this prejudice and it is self-fulfilling. I will re-experience old hurts, as I am programmed that way. Kind of scary.

Topic: Fear and hurt Tue, 05 May 2015

It seems to me fear is a very important factor in deciding how we live. It's a strange or dark reality, as Percy Shelley once mentioned in a poem.

Hurt too, may be one of the largest factors in human behavior. I don't suppose we as people around the world understand this. How our own personal hurts influence how we live every day.

I'd add to this habit, and how that runs our life. It's sort of necessary. A job requires routine. Habit also requires doing things that need to be done.

Centrally, us at this site may regard all this as the interest in psychological security. I can't argue with that. Fear and hurt and habit all are part of that quagmire.

Topic: Higher Thought Sun, 03 May 2015

Jean Gatti wrote: Why do you "bow" ? Are you expecting some 'reward' or 'recognition' from them ?

I don't personally put anybody on a pedestal. I suppose if I met some famous rich person I might be a bit in awe, as most people are, but I doubt I'd be overwhelmed by anyone.

Topic: Higher Thought Sat, 02 May 2015

I suppose I can go further in this argument I'm making with myself. Bear with me. What man has done throughout history (ugh, what a cliche that is) is call something or some person higher than himself. He worships that, but it is still himself. Thought makes a division. It calls one thought low and another high. One wrong and another right. Ideals. Through prayer, for example, it exalts itself, and calls that noble. For most of the people in this world, this makes sense. Somehow they do not see the trick thought is playing. Or am I wrong? If you derive comfort from whatever thoughts bring, who is to say that is nonsense?

Topic: Higher Thought Sat, 02 May 2015

Hi Mike. I'm curious about the ways in which people stratify. Is this how we are intended to live? With the higher and the lower in every field? In the so-called religious world, which we know is a load of bull, they are interested in maintaining a structure. Why not, for it yields power to the higher-ups. To call a man holy, because he occupies a man-made position. Obviously that's absurd and we won't be intrigued by that. At least half the world is though, through calling a man an enlightened being. This must provide them comfort. I don't understand it.

But then there is more. We imagine the successful, the money makers and the famous, to be at a higher level of achievement, and so we bow to them. They, being taught that this is privilege, accept their higher status, and feel ownership. They get away with more because money and status is god in this world.

When we envy, what are we doing? Imaging that another has it better. Looking at one aspect of a person, say their money, and saying, wish I had that.

Anyway, my original point was to deny the existence of anything called higher thought. I haven't made any clever argument to support that. I can just feel it to be so.

Topic: Higher Thought Fri, 01 May 2015

Joe Loveys wrote: This is not how people live. Treating each other according to a class. I'm better than you or you better than me for some reason.

Yet this is how people live.

Topic: Higher Thought Fri, 01 May 2015

There is no higher thought. I'm not sure what else can be said about that. It has fooled people for a long time, and continues to do that. It's surprising that intelligent people believe one person is above another, in some sort of hierarchy. The religious structures are interested in this.

Do our lives work this way, with the upper and the lower? This is not how people live. Treating each other according to a class. I'm better than you or you better than me for some reason.

Topic: Routine Thu, 02 Apr 2015

I don't know. Maybe you are special. Maybe you are someone for whom all these things you write have reality. Just because it goes against my experience with everybody I've ever met doesn't make it unreal.

Anyway, the interesting (?) thing about routine/habit - the comfort it holds, and the deterioration that follows. I guess I'm frightened of that.

Topic: Pretenders Thu, 02 Apr 2015

That's true Jean. Was just wondering how real some of the stuff on this site is. I guess it's all real, but maybe a bit too cerebral at times. Honestly though I don't see this site as more than entertainment. I guess what I mean by that, is there's a kind of mystique about K. and "deep thoughts" but ultimately it leads us nowhere. Still interesting stuff, and maybe I've learned some things from you guys.

Topic: Pretenders Thu, 02 Apr 2015

Several posters here, as some of us have noticed, are not genuine. Why do you guys and girls go on with what is not real for you? Be honest. You do not live in the words you write. We know it, at least it's easy to tell.

What is much more interesting is to tell us of your struggles, not to go on with how you solved a problem. I'm more entertained by real people, not the vision you cast, that is boring.

Topic: Routine Thu, 02 Apr 2015

max greene wrote: Habit and routine are indications that we are asleep. When we are aware of what we are doing, then what we are doing is not mechanical routine -- we see what is going on.

This does happen sometimes. I don't feel asleep during the routine or the noticing of it. Why are you writing things that do not happen for you? They sound wonderful.

Topic: Routine Wed, 01 Apr 2015

Routine, or habit, perhaps defines our lives as much as anything else. There is some comfort or security in this, I guess. Going to the job, and doing the same stuff over and over. I wonder if this is a reason we become dull. Without a lively mind, it is easy to become enclosed. And in habits and routines that go on over years, partly through necessity or through that urge to feel secure, we become sheltered. Not to say this a bad thing. To repeat the same old steps, seems to be a limiting factor. For most people, I'd say this is what defines them in many ways, the predictability. It gives some comfort to us, to know what we are doing, and to see others doing what they do, over and over.

Topic: Living with hurt Sat, 28 Mar 2015

Richard Nolet wrote: Hi Joe. Can one free the mind of old accumulations, memories of hurts, injuries as they arise, come back as a reaction to the present, would maybe be the question.

I dunno. There are times when none of this is a problem. Then there are times when the old stuff still matters. You can see it in others too, like when having a conversation about something recent or even long ago, the impression that past experience has left.

Topic: Living with hurt Sat, 28 Mar 2015

I think hurt plays a very important part in our lives. It's evident in yourself and in others. It's a sneaky thing too, creeping out now and then. The old injuries and the accumulation direct the ship. I'm not sure there is ever a real relief from all that. It seems life itself causes hurt. All we can do is look at it I guess.

Topic: Daily life Sat, 21 Mar 2015

Talking about daily life, we're just talking about life, with all its mundane activities, and routines and habits. It's behavioral and psychological. Part of that is the wish for something else, the imaginary. We impose this on what is really going on. We even call it noble. In the end it is a disappointment. But, just to begin where you are, that sounds reasonable.

Topic: The Known Sun, 15 Mar 2015

I'd say few people ever consider their conditioning. I doubt I would had it not been for stumbling on K books many years ago. I believe he made a point once that when all is well in your life, you don't bother with the questions, things are going OK and you're not too disturbed, comfortable enough. It's when you're troubled you might wonder more about these things.

Topic: The Known Sat, 14 Mar 2015

mike c wrote: Can one realize that it-what is known- is limited?

I thought this was, um, well-known.

Topic: Self Importance Fri, 13 Mar 2015

This is a complicated issue, and I'm not sure how we can look at it. You and me, and the whole world is bent on self-importance. We need to look after ourselves, and we care about family and friends. Then, maybe there is no issue. Look after yourself, and care about those around you. Does this work? This is what we do. Somehow it seems to me like the quote from Wall Street, "Greed is good."

When self-interest is the dominating factor, there is hurt and sadness. As each one pursues his/her own way, there is disregard for others. I don't know if there is a way around this. I have to care about myself and those close to me.

Displaying posts 1 - 30 of 280 in total