Krishnamurti & the Art of Awakening
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Topic: Randal Shacklett Sun, 17 May 2020

dhirendra singh wrote: I doubt that he is in position to afford even internet.

Yes, but almost all public gathering places...shops, restaurants, coffee shops, etc have free wifi. Of course you need a laptop or tablet or smart phone to use it. However in this terrible time of the COVID pandemic most stores and restaurants and coffee shops are closed to the public and only offer delivery. So you won't reach Randall that way sad to say. Nothing is open where I live other than supermarkets and drug stores and hospitals...perhaps some doctors' offices. Perhaps gas stations.

Topic: Krishnamurti said time is the enemy . Can we get into that? Sun, 26 Apr 2020

Ken D wrote: Time shows you truths in a way nothing else can.

Yes! Time can give one some space from being overly focused on the problem or problems. Space which may allow for insight....or who knows what...to happen. The problem may disappear by itself.

Topic: A stroll in a day..... a reflection of the mind....past, present,&future. Sun, 19 Apr 2020

Ken D wrote: What does it mean to "be" something?

Good? Bad? Christian? Free market capitalist? But where does it begin...what’s the root of identification?

Topic: A stroll in a day..... a reflection of the mind....past, present,&future. Fri, 17 Apr 2020

kamarajugadda Mallik ArjunaRao wrote: We know we would hardly want to be nothing.That state would straight away puts us to fear.

Not at all! Our ideas of being nothing create the fear...not the fact. How could nothing create fear....nothing is nothing.

Topic: A stroll in a day..... a reflection of the mind....past, present,&future. Fri, 17 Apr 2020

kamarajugadda Mallik ArjunaRao wrote: Urge to seek gratification through sensations results in desire.This phenomenon quietly brings in authority at every instant.

How so? Can you explain how it brings in authority?

Topic: "we are caught by the world with all its misery." Krishnamurti Thu, 13 Feb 2020

Ken D wrote: Essential reading....all 90 chapters...

Yes. Fascinating book!

Topic: Reza Ganjavi interview with Dr. Scott Forbes Wed, 05 Feb 2020

I decided to make him a new nest in an old basket and some hay; and leave the spring cleaning until spring. Don't know if this is truly selfless action or just the action of myself.

Some mass murderers loved their pets. I think Hitler loved a little stray dog back in his army days. And later I think he showed affection for a different dog.

Topic: Reza Ganjavi interview with Dr. Scott Forbes Tue, 04 Feb 2020

Ken D wrote: Let's not forget that he was also speaking to an audience in India, which does not present the most sterling example of respect for women.

Thank you! Even in the U.S. men used to feel like the wife was the husband’s property....to gratify himself sexually...to cook and clean...to look after the children. In return he supported her financially...almost a form of prostitution. The Woman’s Movement is a relatively recent phenomenon.

Topic: Reza Ganjavi interview with Dr. Scott Forbes Thu, 30 Jan 2020

Wim Opdam wrote: You only know this by hearsay from a daughter who defended here fathers legacy....

Ah! Thanks Wim. I heard about the so called ‘affair’ K had so many times I assumed there was some truth to that. So the only source of that is Rosalind?

Topic: Reza Ganjavi interview with Dr. Scott Forbes Wed, 22 Jan 2020

But these were gifts (or as Jack pointed out, the Mercedes didn't belong to K)....from people who could well afford to give them, as far as I know.

Topic: Reza Ganjavi interview with Dr. Scott Forbes Tue, 21 Jan 2020

Yes, the watches were gifts, as was the Mercedes and the tailor made suits.

Topic: What will dissolve the structure of our self-centred concern? Mon, 30 Dec 2019

Dan McDermott wrote: Does this 'me' have a reality? Except as this self-image that is continuously created and reinforced by thought. Did thought ever have 'life' in the sense of living nature or did it give itself 'life' for whatever reason?

Good questions!

Topic: The Future Of Humanity Fri, 21 Jun 2019

Dan McDermott wrote: That feeling of being a "separate" continuos self is what is being questioned

Right....it's what divides us. Physically we're different....I'm short or fat....you're tall or thin or Black or brown. I'm white. But it's the psychological divisions that we're looking at. It's those that have created all the wars and misery. That K said are fundamentally false. So why is idiot? giving great significance to those? There doesn't seem to be a point to emphasize those

Topic: The Future Of Humanity Fri, 21 Jun 2019

idiot ? wrote: K talks about the common consciousness of mankind, how you are that group consciousness, and how that means that you are not an individual as you think you are. Those are all issues we have been discussing. And I for one have been questioning: Just because we share so much, that doesn't make us the same.

Functionally our consciousness is the same...whether we are an atheist or a Fundamentalist Christian or Hindu. We all have beliefs, ideals, conclusions, ambitions, fears, attachments, desires, hopes, assumptions. Functionally we are the same in that sense. And that’s the sense K is talking of, as I see it.

Topic: The Future Of Humanity Sat, 15 Jun 2019

Sean Hen wrote: idiot ? wrote:

Did K change totally? If he did, did mankind change totally? If mankind did, then why are we still in violence, conflict, suffering?

As far as I can tell, K did indeed "change totally". It seems very clear that mankind didn't change totally.

K said that if one man changes totally he will affect the whole. He didn't say that the effect of his changing will be to totally change the whole. He had an effect, as Einstein's discovery had an effect...not totally changing mankind but having an effect. There's a difference, obviously. I don't think he ever said that if one man changes totally, mankind will be totally changed. Not sure if I expressed this correctly....just got up...need my morning coffee!

Topic: The Future Of Humanity Fri, 14 Jun 2019

idiot ? wrote: It is quite a jump from mankind sharing similar feelings and experiences to there being only a single whole consciousness for mankind. At the very least, that denies or reduces the importance of the particular and asserts or emphasizes the general.

Yes, quite a jump. This ties in with his statement that if one person changes totally, it affects the whole of mankind.

Topic: Are we really "progressing" in our understanding? Wed, 05 Jun 2019

Dan McDermott wrote: what occupies me a lot here and I do keep up with the news, are the comings and goings of the animal life. They seem to me to be totally alive and totally in harmony with their surroundings in ways that we're not.

I’m no expert, but I think the ‘lower ‘ animals may be just as violent as we are, but they don’t have any remorse or guilt. They also don’t have beliefs, ideals, goals, time ...conceptual thinking. And these that have amplified the effects of our animal violence to such an insane degree.

Topic: Are we really "progressing" in our understanding? Wed, 05 Jun 2019

Dan McDermott wrote: Very few Tom, very few, that's my guess...but I live out in the woods, what's it like in the city?

I think you probably realize it was a rhetorical question, Dan. If you’re so isolated that you’re not sure of the answer, just turn on the news for 2 minutes.

Topic: Are we really "progressing" in our understanding? Wed, 05 Jun 2019

Dan McDermott wrote: When the stupidity and ignorance of what is going on is felt deeply, and is understood that that very stupidity is what you are, then the action that comes from that may be the only thing that could bring about the radical change that could save humanity

Many of us feel deeply the stupidity and ignorance of our present way of living. But I think on a subtle or not so subtle level we feel that it’s not me....that it’s the Republicans or the capitalists or the fundamentalist Christians that are causing all the problems. How many of us feel deeply that we are responsible for the mess....or as you say, we ARE the mess...that we are the world?

Topic: Are we really "progressing" in our understanding? Tue, 04 Jun 2019

My question is what we should do and how we should act when we observe something outside of us that is very, very destructive. For example, if capitalism is not regulated, a CEO has the obligation to maximise profits for his/her shareholders and ignore external costs.

No one can tell another what right action should be when faced with the total disorder of capitalism. If you are moved to take political or social action, I don’t think anyone would argue with that. But do we want to turn this forum into just another place to discuss politics or social or environmental issues? There’s already more than enough places online to do that. I’m not sure what discussing the evils of capitalism has to do with the teaching. I think we all agree it’s evil and exploitive and a threat to the survival of the planet.

Topic: Are we really "progressing" in our understanding? Tue, 04 Jun 2019

Huguette . wrote: Capitalism is not the cause of the problem. The cause is the disordered psyche. Greed, fear, hate, measure, comparison, etc., are symptomatic of the disorder. And the root of it is self-ignorance, isn't it?

Yes, all that in bold existed long before capitalism didn't it...in primitive societies? Man against man begins in consciousness. It's the self...the 'me'... that's the cause of violence in the world...the cause of the world disorder. Weren't there warring primitive tribes in ancient times? There were kings and the pharaohs in biblical times. And in the Middle Ages we had feudalism with all it's horrors and exploitation. So man will always find ways to battle and exploit his fellow man unless there's change inwardly...he doesn't need a modern political or economic system to do so.

Topic: Are we really "progressing" in our understanding? Mon, 03 Jun 2019

Sean Hen wrote:

he cooks up a huge pot of soup and goes out at night with a group of friends to feed homeless people sleeping on the street. Now I wouldn't say that my friend's actions here are breeding more conflict.

The issue, it seems to me is, am I violent? Am I perpetuating violence...conflict? Is my consciousness in conflict? If violence/conflict is in 'me' then, inevitably, it will affect the world. What your friend does or does not do is really irrelevant to understanding myself and my own conflict

Topic: Are we really "progressing" in our understanding? Mon, 03 Jun 2019

Sean Hen wrote: he cooks up a huge pot of soup and goes out at night with a group of friends to feed homeless people sleeping on the street. Now I wouldn't say that my friend's actions here are breeding more conflict.

Probably not, but as long as he's in conflict himself, he will be breeding conflict in one way or another....not in this specific act of feeding the homeless, but most assuredly in other ways. Perhaps his drinking brings conflict with his spouse, if he has one. Or prevents him from being responsible in his relationships in daily living. Hopefully he doesn't get behind the wheel and drive drunk. Look at the violence he's doing to his body...to his liver. I'm old enough to remember many anti war activists from the Vietnam war era. Many of them were very violent people. But they did help to end that particular war, not denying the good in that. And then we got Bush and another war...and on and on.

Topic: Are we really "progressing" in our understanding? Mon, 03 Jun 2019

Huguette . wrote: Isn’t the essential thing for each one of us to understand the relationship between the external problems and the inner conflict so that, whatever our station in society, our understanding acts and there is an organic recovery?

Good point, Huguette! As long as I'm in conflict, I breed conflict in the world. Capitalism is based upon competition....fragmentation....the boss/owner vs the worker and my corporation vs. the others...my country vs yours, etc. This is a result of our inner fragmentation, beliefs, and violence, isn't it....seeing 'me' separate from 'you', and 'me' separate from 'not me'?

Topic: Are we really "progressing" in our understanding? Mon, 03 Jun 2019

Sean Hen wrote: Peaceful campaigning and awareness raising can be very powerful ways to bring about changes in policy of both corporations and governments. Isn't this a sensible thing to do given the gravity of the situation?

It seems to be so, but it's not working. Friends of ours...much older, from my parents' generation...spent their whole lives working peacefully for change....they are in their 90's now, if they're still living. Well many, many, people like them spent their lives doing this 'awareness raising' and we wound up with Donald Trump. BTW, they also worked with Ralph Nader, who was fighting the good fight his whole life (ran for president against Bush and Gore, taking much needed votes away from Gore) and wound up almost totally forgotten today.

Topic: Are we really "progressing" in our understanding? Sun, 02 Jun 2019

Sean Hen wrote: However, in terms of saving the planet what needs to be done is to campaign to change the system which is destroying it. If we continue to live in a capitalistic system which is driven by growth in GDP as a measure of success, this will push the environment beyond a very dangerous tipping point.

The rich and powerful will willingly give up their vast wealth and power? (A rhetorical question). Since the answer is obviously no, the alternative would be the kind of violent revolution that took place under Mao in China. The rich capitalists would have to be rounded up and imprisoned...or exterminated, when they resist. How many millions were imprisoned and murdered during Mao's revolution? I'm all in favor of a more progressive income tax here in the U.S....like increasing the tax on the most wealthy to 70%, but even that relatively simple change is not likely to get passed by a congress that works for the rich and powerful. The core issues are division, greed and power (for me) which are characteristics of the human mind....human consciousness. K always pointed out that change must begin there...in me.

Topic: What can one learn about one self. Thu, 21 Feb 2019

I worked with the handicapped for many years O.S....but enough said about this issue. It has no bearing on what we are here for.

Topic: What can one learn about one self. Thu, 21 Feb 2019

The picture is not clear . seriously what is it? Is someone on the wheelchair, is that you ?

It’s just another image One Self....and the image is not the person. And I’ll leave it at that. In this day of the internet I could put up a photo of the pope and claim it was me :)

Topic: What can one learn about one self. Thu, 21 Feb 2019

Is it for us to feel sorry for you and listen to you or what?

It’s for you to envy me, One Self, :)

Topic: What can one learn about one self. Thu, 21 Feb 2019

Wim Opdam wrote: Truth will unfold itself for those who enquire their own actions and only to them and for them and to or for no one else.

One Self: I don't know what it is but your slogan makes me sick to look at. Honestly, the language is retarded.

Your post, One Self, speaks volumes about who you are, sad to say. Wim is not a native English speaker, btw.

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